123
Senior Member
...
Here's my situation. I have a second home about 2 hours away, it's zero right now which kept me from heading out there. Which got me to thinking....
I have a premise system right now with Insteon switches and dimmers (pretty basic). The house has boiler heat with a basic thermostat on the wall. How would you integrate the thermostat into premise? Which product would you install and any tips?
Thanks,
Adam
PS.. Premise is a great tool - many of today's tools do a great job imitating it. Maybe if we produce enough traffic (not about viagra or degrees), Motorola may give us the source code or pick this back up.
======================
Not to be pessimistic or anything, but it would have to be a very great deal of traffic for Motorola to release the Premise code base to the masses. They are using the SYS code in its most basic form for many internal and commercial projects. Motorola did after all pay good money for the product IP (and the product team), and I think corporate counsel is not likely to let them give it up very easily, just as a matter of principle. Selling it may be an altogether different matter...
On a lighter note, we are still installing Premise (albeit for only the most high-end custom opportunities), and using it for other projects as well. Premise is still the best middleware automation/control platform ever created and it's almost a decade old. Premise Rocks!!
Good work Tim/Christian/Behnaz/Jim/Jim/Jim/Benji/Mike/Dan/Dave/David/Fragmo/Jeff/Eric/Irene/Todd/David/Jill! Oh and me too.
To answer your question below: The Aprilaire 8870 is still the best and most widely used (even OEM'ed by AMX) thermostat out there.
Damon
======================
All you need is the 8870 and a power supply for it. To connect it to premise, you'll need either the 8811 protocol adapter (to connect using a regular RS232 serial port), or a UDS10/UDS100.
======================
I made the mistake of buying the 8811 protocol adapter and then finding out that the UDS10 could connect to the thermostats directly.
Patrik
======================
You're probably right, but it never hurts to hope. It'd be great if premise would be open-sourced as a framework - I think support from the open-source community would be huge.
Re the 8870 - thanks for the tip. I found it online and am making my parts list. Is there any way to run bypass the controller? Seems like a lot of money for 1 zone.... I only have 1 zone (not a big house) and I'm just looking for something cheap I can integrate into Premise so I can turn the heat up before headed out there.
Thanks,
Adam
======================
Damon,
Thanks for adding a few more details to Premise's history. Kudos to the whole team for breaking new ground in the HA market.
I read the SDK's doc recently and it gave me a better appreciation of SYS's architecture. I know I still have a cursory understanding of its inner workings but enough to make me wonder why they gave up on such a powerful tool. Now I know better; they shelved the product (Premise) but continue to use the technology (SYS). Definitely seems unlikely they'll give it up to open-source.
Clearly there were a few ex-Microsofties on the development team because Builder's UI appears related to Visual Studio.
Not meaning to dilute this forum but Premise users ought to know that there is considerably more HA-related traffic on the Cocoontech forum ... and they filter out the spam. I posted a question asking who uses Premise and several people stepped forward (and the post has
received over 400 views within 5 days). People are interested in Premise.
The major hurdles are a lack of good drivers for current, popular lighting technologies (zwave, insteon) and Premise's dated browser-UI. Plus the driver SDK is intimidating ... examples beyond "helloworld" would've been handy.
Damon, your Jukebox example refutes the notion that premise's UI must be boring. I can only imagine what you've invented since jukebox!
If the folks at Digital Residence aren't members yet, may I suggest they join Cocoontech. Several Home Automation and Home Security companies regularly post in the forums and increase their public profile by helping the DIY community and expanding HA awareness.
Cocoontech's moderator encourages its professional members to sign posts with their company name.
If you had a driver for zwave, insteon, or the Elk M1 and you made it available (free or for a nominal fee) you'd be an instant hit with the community. In return, you'd inspire others to discover Premise and develop new drivers that you could use for your projects. Even if you chose not to give away your R&D dollars, simply answering questions is an easy way to get publicity.
Taras
PS
If you got a sec, could you take a crack at my HR12A question (posted here)?
<sheepish grin>
======================
I read Cocoontech almost every day. A good resource for the nuts and bolt of automation/control.
We've developed a Z-Wave driver, but use it for many pursuits and would have to consider licensing it or giving it away.
As for your HR12A question, sorry but we don't touch anything to do with X10.
======================
Taras,
Check out the Files area. You might find some interesting modules (i.e. Insteon).
======================
What kind of begging would it take to get you make the Z-Wave driver available?
Thanks,
Adam
Here's my situation. I have a second home about 2 hours away, it's zero right now which kept me from heading out there. Which got me to thinking....
I have a premise system right now with Insteon switches and dimmers (pretty basic). The house has boiler heat with a basic thermostat on the wall. How would you integrate the thermostat into premise? Which product would you install and any tips?
Thanks,
Adam
PS.. Premise is a great tool - many of today's tools do a great job imitating it. Maybe if we produce enough traffic (not about viagra or degrees), Motorola may give us the source code or pick this back up.
======================
Not to be pessimistic or anything, but it would have to be a very great deal of traffic for Motorola to release the Premise code base to the masses. They are using the SYS code in its most basic form for many internal and commercial projects. Motorola did after all pay good money for the product IP (and the product team), and I think corporate counsel is not likely to let them give it up very easily, just as a matter of principle. Selling it may be an altogether different matter...
On a lighter note, we are still installing Premise (albeit for only the most high-end custom opportunities), and using it for other projects as well. Premise is still the best middleware automation/control platform ever created and it's almost a decade old. Premise Rocks!!
Good work Tim/Christian/Behnaz/Jim/Jim/Jim/Benji/Mike/Dan/Dave/David/Fragmo/Jeff/Eric/Irene/Todd/David/Jill! Oh and me too.
To answer your question below: The Aprilaire 8870 is still the best and most widely used (even OEM'ed by AMX) thermostat out there.
Damon
======================
All you need is the 8870 and a power supply for it. To connect it to premise, you'll need either the 8811 protocol adapter (to connect using a regular RS232 serial port), or a UDS10/UDS100.
======================
I made the mistake of buying the 8811 protocol adapter and then finding out that the UDS10 could connect to the thermostats directly.
Patrik
======================
You're probably right, but it never hurts to hope. It'd be great if premise would be open-sourced as a framework - I think support from the open-source community would be huge.
Re the 8870 - thanks for the tip. I found it online and am making my parts list. Is there any way to run bypass the controller? Seems like a lot of money for 1 zone.... I only have 1 zone (not a big house) and I'm just looking for something cheap I can integrate into Premise so I can turn the heat up before headed out there.
Thanks,
Adam
======================
Damon,
Thanks for adding a few more details to Premise's history. Kudos to the whole team for breaking new ground in the HA market.
I read the SDK's doc recently and it gave me a better appreciation of SYS's architecture. I know I still have a cursory understanding of its inner workings but enough to make me wonder why they gave up on such a powerful tool. Now I know better; they shelved the product (Premise) but continue to use the technology (SYS). Definitely seems unlikely they'll give it up to open-source.
Clearly there were a few ex-Microsofties on the development team because Builder's UI appears related to Visual Studio.
Not meaning to dilute this forum but Premise users ought to know that there is considerably more HA-related traffic on the Cocoontech forum ... and they filter out the spam. I posted a question asking who uses Premise and several people stepped forward (and the post has
received over 400 views within 5 days). People are interested in Premise.
The major hurdles are a lack of good drivers for current, popular lighting technologies (zwave, insteon) and Premise's dated browser-UI. Plus the driver SDK is intimidating ... examples beyond "helloworld" would've been handy.
Damon, your Jukebox example refutes the notion that premise's UI must be boring. I can only imagine what you've invented since jukebox!
If the folks at Digital Residence aren't members yet, may I suggest they join Cocoontech. Several Home Automation and Home Security companies regularly post in the forums and increase their public profile by helping the DIY community and expanding HA awareness.
Cocoontech's moderator encourages its professional members to sign posts with their company name.
If you had a driver for zwave, insteon, or the Elk M1 and you made it available (free or for a nominal fee) you'd be an instant hit with the community. In return, you'd inspire others to discover Premise and develop new drivers that you could use for your projects. Even if you chose not to give away your R&D dollars, simply answering questions is an easy way to get publicity.
Taras
PS
If you got a sec, could you take a crack at my HR12A question (posted here)?
<sheepish grin>
======================
I read Cocoontech almost every day. A good resource for the nuts and bolt of automation/control.
We've developed a Z-Wave driver, but use it for many pursuits and would have to consider licensing it or giving it away.
As for your HR12A question, sorry but we don't touch anything to do with X10.
======================
Taras,
Check out the Files area. You might find some interesting modules (i.e. Insteon).
======================
What kind of begging would it take to get you make the Z-Wave driver available?
Thanks,
Adam