Sprinkler System

[DanITman]

I am having someone come out to give me a bid on a sprinkler system for my yard. I would like to know where to start to research the possiblity of automating the sprinkler systems with Home Automation. I have a cpu built that is dedicate for my Home Automation needs and it is running Homeseer. I will go to their forums to figure out the software side, but I first need ideas on the hardware needed.

From what I gather, I would have contracted out the entire sprinkler system, but the controll is the one piece I would request a different type, as that is what I would be controlling.

So, that's about as much as I know for terms of HA for a sprinkler system. Can someone guide me in the right place with literature to read or give me some ideas on what to look for?

This spring I did the same exact thing you are doing now. While getting the quotes together I made them aware of my home automation system and they were very accommodating to my needs. The wire bundle that controls the valves is strung alone the main supply pipe in your yard. This wire is typically put in your garage with a controller to control your zones. I wanted to keep this functionality in case I ever sold the home they would have a simple (cheap) controller to control the system from the garage. Haveing my automation controller in the garage wasn't going to work for me because I decided on EtherRain (more on that later). The installer had a great idea and spliced the bundle of wire and put a second feed of that wire into my basement so I could have my automation system control the valves as well. He just spliced into it mid way where it comes close to my utilities and put a bunch of extra wire outside and then I fed it into my basement next to my gas line. He did this as part of the standard install for me.

For my controller I am using EtherRain. I LOVE this product. So simple to use and has a built in rain detector for local rain detection. There are many ways to schedule your controller.

1.) Comes with software for Windows or Mac to control it
2.) Homeseer driver.
3.) User lawncheck.com to program it
4.) Write your own controller using their well documented API

I'm in the processes or writing my own controller in PHP (because I find that fun) and until I finish that I'm using their website lawncheck.com to control my scheduling. As long as EtherRain is hooked up to your router and has access to the internet it can be controller from lawncheck.com. This site takes into account forecasting and temperature to determine your schedule.

 

[tannebil]

+1 for EtherRain. http://www.quicksmart.com/qs_etherrain.html 8 zones per controller.

I added the rain sensor and use LawnCheck to manage my schedule.

One consideration on the install is to make sure that each zone has similar drainage. That wasn't considered when my sprinklers were installed and I ended up with a soggy area.

 

[gfs]

best sprikler software package is mcs sprinkler... see mike mcsharry's earlier post... really a great program.

 

[pete_c]

AnthonyZ,

Appears that maybe lightning took out my two Rain8Nets. They've been fine for about 8 years. The serial connection was going to an Edgeport 8. The serial port utilized on the Edgeport appears not to function any more. This is the first time I've had an issue with an Edgeport. I switched the two Rain8nets to another serial port and noticed that I get responses from one of the two Rain8Nets and not the other one. Testing the one "working" Rain8Net it reponds to commands but doesn't turn on and off the sprinkler relays (also checked with a VOM) and I see no voltages.

Most likely I will replace the two. I took it apart and checked the diodes and they appear to be fine. Actually the two Rain8Net boards appear just fine. Any suggestions for further diagnostics? I've also written to WGL about repairing them. I also noticed that I paid something like $60-70 for them in the early 2000's. I have the very first Rain8Nets built by WGL.

I am thinking of keeping the RS-232 methodology; but removing the wired piece and use wireless RS-232; as I haven't tried this. Wierd though that I've never seen just one port go on a Digi Edgeport. I'm guess the lightning damage occurred from the Rainbird rain sensor as its mounted almost at the top of the roof. It is connected to the cluster of wires going to the controller box. I did put a DS10A on the end of it in the old controller box. Instead though now I may move the DS10 outside to the sprinkler box such that the path of the cabling of the Rainbird rain detector ends in the sprinkler manifold box.

For kicks I did a "RS-232 sprinkler controller" google search and other than the "roll your own" projects only the WGL products came up.

I'm still concerned that lightning may have damaged the actual sprinkler solenoids. Can you suggest an easy way to test each of them? I still have the old Rainbird controller; so it wouldn't be an issue to connect it temporarily; but can I just apply voltage to each of the solenoids to test just some jumper cables from the 24V PS?

 

[mustangcoupe]

I'm still concerned that lightning may have damaged the actual sprinkler solenoids. Can you suggest an easy way to test each of them? I still have the old Rainbird controller; so it wouldn't be an issue to connect it temporarily; but can I just apply voltage to each of the solenoids to test just some jumper cables from the 24V PS?

Yes the valves are powered by 24VAC so you could connect the 2 wires from each zone to the power supply, and it should water if it is still good. Dont connect all at once because the supply may only be rated for X number of zones open at once.

 

[pete_c]

Thanks Todd.

Just comparing what lightning did to the Rainbird controller in the FL house. It took out a fuse and the PS; but the board was fine. I just replaced the PS and the fuse and all was well. I did have to change 4 of the solenoids. There though they were kind of buried in the sand. But they were not working when I tested them; so I am guessing that lightning may have taken them out. Its too bad that the WGL controllers didn't have replacable fuse links for lightning damage. I have read that the newer ones do have protection circuits. I wonder how well these work. I'm guessing the weak link in the WGL controllers was the part that goes to the serial port. I am lucky though considering that the DigiEdgeport only lost one port (of 8). Its connected to a Digi 7 port USB box and another Digi 8 port serial box and a couple of additional USB devices. Nothing else appear damaged. So relating to construction of the Digi Edgeports (USB to 8 Serial devices); I'm thinking its a good design.

 

[tenholde]

Thanks Todd.

Just comparing what lightning did to the Rainbird controller in the FL house. It took out a fuse and the PS; but the board was fine. I just replaced the PS and the fuse and all was well. I did have to change 4 of the solenoids. There though they were kind of buried in the sand. But they were not working when I tested them; so I am guessing that lightning may have taken them out. Its too bad that the WGL controllers didn't have replacable fuse links for lightning damage. I have read that the newer ones do have protection circuits. I wonder how well these work. I'm guessing the weak link in the WGL controllers was the part that goes to the serial port. I am lucky though considering that the DigiEdgeport only lost one port (of 8). Its connected to a Digi 7 port USB box and another Digi 8 port serial box and a couple of additional USB devices. Nothing else appear damaged. So relating to construction of the Digi; I'm thinking its a good design.

Lightning strike yesterday in St. Louis took out my sprinkler control, and some other things in the house. The exact same things that were damaged last year in a similar strike. Haven't diagnosed problems yet, but last time it was the serial port on the RainNet that failed and a single port on one of my ethernet switches. In both cases the wires for each were run through the attic, so I am assuming a big EMF pulse from the ligthning hitting nearby caused the damage.

tenholde

 

[pete_c]

Thanks tenholde,

I've made the endeavor a new puzzle to solve. 8 years with the same setup has worked OK; so I guess I've been lucky up until the last couple of thunderstorms.

Pretty much all of the sprinkler wiring is below ground with the manifold and solenoids about 1 foot underground. Wiring cluster to controller basically is buried along side of the house into the basement to the garage controller area. The only device that is part of the sprinkler system that is high up is the Rainbird rain sensor - which by the way is still functional with the DS10 its connected to. What I am seeing so far though is the "weak link" in the entire system was the Rain8net (?). If I can go to earth ground with the newer WGL Rain8Net; it should be plug n play. I have both conduit and copper water pipes very near the sprinkler control box.

 

[Ira]

Here is a surge suppressor specifically made for irrigation controllers, including Rain8's.

My plan is to use wireless mirror relays to physically isolate the zones from any controller hardware (except the mirror relay). I will probably use one of tmanufacturing's suppressors to add a layer of protection between the mirror relay and the zone valves. For less than $40, it's worth a try.

The wireless relay boards are supposed to arrive tomorrow. It's the last piece of the puzzle for my ultimate 3-way irrigation control system.

Ira

 

[pete_c]

Thanks Ira,

So I will put one of these between the RS-232 Digi box and the serial controlled sprinkler controller?

Looking at the device; it appears to be mainly for use for the 8 zone WGL Rain8Net.

I think I could fit one of these with the two RS-232 in/out and 8 zone passthru; not sure though if two would fit inside of the Rainbird controller box.

I cannot really go with any bigger footprint than the size of the current Rainbird controller box. So I would have to make it fit.

I could maybe stack the two Rain8Nets on one side and the two 00620's on the other side using standoffs from the plastic of the Rainbird box and in between two of these.

Or just put them inside of the basement where the sprinkler wiring cluster enters the home from the Rainbird box. This is where I have water pipes. Not really a big deal to tack these to the rafters. I'm guessing should something occur that there would be no flameout on the board. I have natural gas pipes also right around there.

 

[Ira]

Thanks Ira,

So I will put one of these between the RS-232 Digi box and the serial controlled sprinkler controller?

Looking at the device; it appears to be mainly for use for the 8 zone WGL Rain8Net.

I think I could fit one of these with the two RS-232 in/out and 8 zone passthru; not sure though if two would fit inside of the Rainbird controller box.

I cannot really go with any bigger footprint than the size of the current Rainbird controller box. So I would have to make it fit.

I don't have one, but it looks like that is how it is connected. The wiring diagram on the web page shows the RJ11 cable as Rain8 -> suppressor -> PC. In your case, the PC is the Digi box. If you have more than eight zones, you need more than one board (assuming you want to protect all the zones).

The different model descriptions are a little confusing. If it were me, I would email them and ask what they recommend, given your setup. I emailed them with a question a few months ago and they responded within a day or two.

What is that sitting above your controller box in the third picture?

Ira

 

[pete_c]

Ira,

I looked at the diagrams for the wiring and it looks straight forward. The better device takes care of 8 zones (8 solenoids) and an in and out for the RS-232 via RJ-11s(looks to be that). The board is kind of big for taking care of 8 zones. My capacity is current set to 16 zones and I have only 10 zones wired with 5 heads at each zone. The setup in Florida is 8 zones using the Rainbird ESP with the same box I have in Illinois. With only 8 zones it would be an easy fit. My sister living nearby has about 20 zones covering her property in a similiar sized Rainbird box / controller.
There I could put in three Rain8Nets but no way I could fit any more than that unless I went to a second box next to the first box (which I could do in her garage).

What is that sitting above your controller box in the third picture?

Touchscreen. The Rainbird box is going to stay there for now but I've thought of removing it a few times. I don't really want to make it any bigger; nor add another box adjacent to it. Initially though I have considered moving it into the wall such that just the cover was flush to the drywall.

 

[pete_c]

Here's Rainbird's methodology of lightning protection and WGL's.

 

[tenholde]

Lightning strike yesterday in St. Louis took out my sprinkler control, and some other things in the house. The exact same things that were damaged last year in a similar strike. Haven't diagnosed problems yet, but last time it was the serial port on the RainNet that failed and a single port on one of my ethernet switches. In both cases the wires for each were run through the attic, so I am assuming a big EMF pulse from the ligthning hitting nearby caused the damage.

tenholde

Okay, I have diagnosed further what failed, and it was NOT the Rain8Net but the serial port on my 8-port MOXA C168H that was fried.

This makes me feel better, as (1) I have the Pro version of the Rain8Net that is suppossed to have lightning protection built in, and (2) I have an open serial port on the MOXA. I am back up and running!

Tenholde

 

[pete_c]

I checked out all 10 of the Rainbird solenoids and they are all just fine. So it looks to be just the Rain8Net's and the Digi box (which I have spares of - but still looking at how one port would go on the box).

The rain8net boards look simple and there's really not much to them; so am wondering how easy it would be to fix.

On the first board (and using the second board for comparison as they are identical); did the quick VOM diode check without pulling any leads up. So far I see that the two diodes adjacent to the RJ11 are shorted out. This is the board which appears to work as its getting a response from the test application but didn't output anything to the valves.