ground moisture sensor

apostolakisl

Senior Member
I struggle trying to get the lawn to automatically water when and only when it actually needs it. Trying to work in all of the variables such as rain fall, humidity, temperature, hours of sunlight is overwhelming. What it all comes down to is whether the ground is moist.

So, has anyone set up a system that does this and if so how did you do it and does it really work?
 
Hello Lou,

Bill over on the SH forum reported good success using the Vegetronix sensors/relay interface.

Hi post is located here: ISY/Veggetronix Irrigation

The Vegetronix sensors look sweet, but when I added up to cost of interfaces, sensors, and wire to cover 6 Zones on my acre lot I decided to procrastinate.

I have also tried various freeware and sample calculation routines for evaprotraspiration calculations. Unfortunately, many of these routines don't specify the units for the variables they require. Like you, I've struggled. I may be missing something but these routines consistently under-calculate for my soil (sand).

Universal-Devices is currently working on incorporating evapotranspiration calculations in the ISY99. This would be used in conjunction with the weatherbug module. I'm hoping they can come up with a workable solution where I have struggled.
 
Same boat as you guys above - I bought a HB soil moisture sensor and it has sat in its box. My dream system would be a sensor in each zone and then running each zone exactly how long/how often it is needed.

I had pretty good luck using a combination of a HB rain guage and some Homeseer scripting logic that would give the whole lawn 1/2" twice a week including rain that already fell. But then my rain guage started acting flaky and now it sits in a box in my new house. I need to install a new sprinker system in my new yard, my current plan is to figure out what is up with this rain guage or get a new one and continue using the 1" / week method, tweaking each zone up or down occasionally if I see a section of the lawn needs more or less water.
 
I have been evaluating the Vegitronix moisture probe this season in two different environments. I had also evaluated the HB gypsum-based moisture sensor in past years.

In a desert climate where the moisture in the soil is limited then I found the moisture sensor to be very effective. With it I was able to adjust the duration of the irrigation cycle to assure sufficient water was available in the soil until the next cycle. In the moderate Northwest climate the soil has considerable holding capacity and only the surface moisture is lost due to the summer weather.

In the NW when I raised the level of the moisture sensor to be at the same approx depth as the grass roots (around 2 to 3 inches) then the sensor would modulate based upon surface temperature. I suspect during the nightime the moisture would tend to migrate somewhat from lower to higher depths. What this means is the moisture sensor is not effect in this environment for irrigation control. In the desert climate it would be effective.

The ET calculation does a very good job of determining how much moisture has been lost through the crop/grass and this is the amount that needs to be replenished. This means that the ET-based control will suit any environment and soil type.

The chart compares mositure readings in the two environments. The green line shows a steady moisture loss until the next irrigation cycle. The pink line shows a relatively steady moisture content. Both probes during this period extends about 6" into the soil. The low values in the green line show dry soil at the 6" level. Full soil moisture after irrigation is about 2.2V. This 2.2V is effectively the steady state condition at 6" in the NW.
 

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The Vegetronix sensors look sweet, but when I added up to cost of interfaces, sensors, and wire to cover 6 Zones on my acre lot I decided to procrastinate.

I have also tried various freeware and sample calculation routines for evaprotraspiration calculations. Unfortunately, many of these routines don't specify the units for the variables they require. Like you, I've struggled. I may be missing something but these routines consistently under-calculate for my soil (sand).

Universal-Devices is currently working on incorporating evapotranspiration calculations in the ISY99. This would be used in conjunction with the weatherbug module. I'm hoping they can come up with a workable solution where I have struggled.

For anyone serious about doing irrigation control with moisture sensors then look at http://www.irrometer.com/sensors.html This is the technology that has proven to be effective and there is considerable effort and cost to setup a system that really works. With most of what this thread is discussing is taking single point measurements and assuming the irrigation distribution and the moisture channels with the soil are perfect. For hobbiest that like to tinker it can be enjoyable, but dont expect good results using moisture sensors other than for specific applications. There are many parameters that affect soil moisture so development of heuristics based upon some readily avialble ones (e.g. Temperature) can be rewarding and will be better than something that does not take into account any environmental factors. When trying to do something similiar wth moisture sensors the results may not always provide better results that just a timed cycle.

In my evaluation of the Vegitronix I used WebControl A/D which will support 4 analog inputs. I used only one at each of two locations being evaluated. I was drawn to the Vegitronix based upon its easy installation and new technology. I had given up with the gypsum-based sensor. I am not going to change from ET-based scheduling, but I did want to sample the technology to see what it offerred.

There is much literature on Evapotranspiration and there are many research results that use different calculations. What you will find is that the most widely used equations require sensors that are not generally availalbe with real time data over the internet. Over the years I have had mcsSprinklers users with whom I have worked in various locations in the world to develop an ET calculation based upon data that is generally avaialable on the internet. I have also worked with a local user who has implemented the system at the link above for soil moisture and he found that mcsSprinklers soil moisture calculations based upon ET tracked very well with the moisture sensor. He also uses the ET for scheduling and the moisture sensor field just for confirmation.
 
thanks for the detailed reponses.

I do have an ISY so that may be a future option for me. I don't know just how good the weather reporting stations are for my area. The temps are correct but I don't think the rainfall measurements are anywhere near correct and am a bit skeptical of wind readings. I actually have an elementary school .1 miles away but they aren't on weatherbug. Maybe I should convince the principal what a great teaching tool it would be for them to monitor and report!

We are hitting some hard times here in Austin, TX. 100 plus every day now since 8/1. I will not be doing any outdoor work until fall as I refuse to suffer in the heat. For now, I will stay in my cool house and hit the sprinkle button.

I would be willing to put up a nice weather station at my house if there were a way to plug the data into an ET equation that worked and that could somehow control the sprinkler. It sounds like that ET calculation is perhaps hit or miss depending on my local soil and other factors.

I know that I need to work on my irrigation. As I watch the parts of the yard that weren't the greatest when it was cooler become lush and vice versa for the others, it is clear that I was overwatering areas some in the cooler weather and now underwatering the other areas in the heat.
 
I depend on both my outdoor weather instruments and local WUN weather stations for data relating to ET.

Last week some rabbits ate my 12VAC low voltage wiring to one side of the home, AAG Anenometer wiring and Dallas Rain bucket wiring. This played havoc with my ET calculations for a couple of days (over the weekend).

I built a rain bucket from a cheap Menards rain counter and HB counter a few months back. It is documented here:

Make your own 1-wire rain bucket

In the midwest we've had a stretch of over 80F weather now for the last couple of months or so. We've also had some major rain downpours which helped a lot keeping the grass green. Because of this combo I don't think the system ran more than 10 times in the last two months and grass is looking nice (also cutting it high helped a bit). In our subdivision we also have watering restrictions (days / odd / even) and for about 3 weeks we also had a total water ban.
 
For anyone serious about doing irrigation control with moisture sensors then look at http://www.irrometer.com/sensors.html This is the technology that has proven to be effective and there is considerable effort and cost to setup a system that really works. With most of what this thread is discussing is taking single point measurements and assuming the irrigation distribution and the moisture channels with the soil are perfect. For hobbiest that like to tinker it can be enjoyable, but dont expect good results using moisture sensors other than for specific applications. There are many parameters that affect soil moisture so development of heuristics based upon some readily avialble ones (e.g. Temperature) can be rewarding and will be better than something that does not take into account any environmental factors. When trying to do something similiar wth moisture sensors the results may not always provide better results that just a timed cycle.

In my evaluation of the Vegitronix I used WebControl A/D which will support 4 analog inputs. I used only one at each of two locations being evaluated. I was drawn to the Vegitronix based upon its easy installation and new technology. I had given up with the gypsum-based sensor. I am not going to change from ET-based scheduling, but I did want to sample the technology to see what it offerred.

There is much literature on Evapotranspiration and there are many research results that use different calculations. What you will find is that the most widely used equations require sensors that are not generally availalbe with real time data over the internet. Over the years I have had mcsSprinklers users with whom I have worked in various locations in the world to develop an ET calculation based upon data that is generally avaialable on the internet. I have also worked with a local user who has implemented the system at the link above for soil moisture and he found that mcsSprinklers soil moisture calculations based upon ET tracked very well with the moisture sensor. He also uses the ET for scheduling and the moisture sensor field just for confirmation.

Michael,

Thank you so much for sharing your data on the Vegetronix moisture sensors. It's not often that one runs across hard data under such diverse conditions. If I had any thoughts remaining about deploying a 6 zone sensor system, they are now completely gone. I may, as you have stated, sample the technology to get an idea of the moisture variation in my area.

The Evapotranspiration calculations that I have used do appear to work in my area for stable environmental conditions. I live in extreme northern Indiana (1/8th of a mile from MI) an near the Lake Michigan. During the Summer, our days are fairly consistent with temps in the high 80's and humidity in the 50 to 70% range.

ET calculations consistently predict 0.3" of moisture loss for most days. I have used this prediction to tailor my irrigation times to provide 1/2 of the predicted moisture loss and run the system twice a day. Sun/shade areas have been tailored through trial and error nozzle size adjustment (yep - been at this for 8 years).

My issue is with the soil composition - a thin topsoil layer over sand. I water twice a day because water percolation through the soil is a significant factor. Watering for longer periods is simply a waste since the soil cannot retain the water. This is the factor that I have yet to characterize (other than by trial and error). Using a straight ET calculation would cause my system to delay watering for days after a !" rainfall. In fact, the soil cannot retain the moisture, and requires watering within 1 day.

Either the Vegetronix sensor or the Irrometer would be useful in characterizing the ability of the soil to retain moisture. There is a threshold that I have yet to find.

Thanks again for the data and the insight,
IM
 
The Evapotranspiration calculations that I have used do appear to work in my area for stable environmental conditions. I live in extreme northern Indiana (1/8th of a mile from MI) an near the Lake Michigan. During the Summer, our days are fairly consistent with temps in the high 80's and humidity in the 50 to 70% range.

ET calculations consistently predict 0.3" of moisture loss for most days. I have used this prediction to tailor my irrigation times to provide 1/2 of the predicted moisture loss and run the system twice a day. Sun/shade areas have been tailored through trial and error nozzle size adjustment (yep - been at this for 8 years).

My issue is with the soil composition - a thin topsoil layer over sand. I water twice a day because water percolation through the soil is a significant factor. Watering for longer periods is simply a waste since the soil cannot retain the water. This is the factor that I have yet to characterize (other than by trial and error). Using a straight ET calculation would cause my system to delay watering for days after a !" rainfall. In fact, the soil cannot retain the moisture, and requires watering within 1 day.

Either the Vegetronix sensor or the Irrometer would be useful in characterizing the ability of the soil to retain moisture. There is a threshold that I have yet to find.

Thanks again for the data and the insight,
IM

IM,

As I understand it, you have (grass?) growing in thin ( = ? inches? ) topsoil over (dune ?) sand.

You are on the right track -- "almost there", as it were , and as we almost always seem to be in trying to accurately predict the behavior of natural systems ;-)

The computational problem you have is not strictly speaking with the ET component. ET is always a negative term in the mass balance equation. You can get to the right answer computationally by refining your conceptual -- and resulting computational -- mass balance model.

Water In -Water Out = +/- Change in Storage.

I presume that your overiding overall objective is to keep soil moisture (generally speaking for most plants) greater than the wilting point.

Check to see whether the roots of the plants you need to irrigate extend significantly through the topsoil. If not, you can make the simplifying assumption that what you are trying to model (= predict) is the amount of water in the topsoil alone or, alternatively to the depth of the roots for shallow-rooted plants.

(((You might also ask yourself why you are growing this grass in this location with all the attendant problems. There are deep-rooted native grasses that would likely do jist fine albeit with a different aesthetic ... http://www.duneland.com/news/2010/02/dunes...-plant-sale.php)))

Then estimate the specific retention ( ~ specific capacity) of the top soil.

You wrote correctly: "This is the factor that I have yet to characterize ". Specific retention is defined as the amount of water retained after a fully saturated porous medium is allowed to drain completely (gravity drainage). This is the maximum amount of water your newly-defined 'system' (the topsoil) can hold. So if the soil specfic retention is say, 1.0", you would take as an initial condition for your model of 1" of water in storage at the end of any rainfall in equal to or greater than 1.0".

You can detemine the specific retention by:

1) saturating the soil in place,
2) allowing it to drain,
3) digging up/coring a cylinder or plug of it with an carefully estimated soil volume prior to disturbance
5) removing (most emergent) vegetation
4) weighing the wet soil,
5) drying it,
6)-reweighing
7) calculating

If you choose a large enough piece with actively growing grass, you can also detemine the wilting point by not (5) drying it, but rather waiting for it to slowly and naturally dry to the point that the grass appears stressed. Weigh it at that point to determne the amount of water that is in your model volume at the 'wilting point',then, as before, 5), dry, 6) re-weigh and calculate to determine specific capacity.

Hope This Helps ... Marc
hult at hydrologist dot com
 
I put a few Evergreen trees and a couple of burms to alleviate top soil erosion. I had a very thin over clay lawn on the back of the lot. The runoff would cause a quick drying area of grass which never stayed green and a ponding effect in the center of the yard. I redid some drainage doing a "french" well scenario / and rerouting some of the water the flow to the storm drains. Its helped over the years and the two burm's plants / evergreen trees are doing very well. Here's a before and after picture. (2002 and 2010).
 
Actually its more directed to the storm sewers. There is also one on the top of the picture. From the top of the picture to the bottom its downhill. Along the top part of the burms there is one storm sewer. On the right side of the picture there are two more storm sewers. The pool too next door has diverted some of the flow of water. The french well was 10' X 20' and it didn't work too well.

Now when it rains there is no more pooling of water in any of the yards pictured. One additional thing done is that I ran the neighbors sump pump flow across and parallel to mine across the back yard to the vicinity of one of the storm drains alleviating the ponding swamping effect between the two houses downhill. It was a major effort of digging a trench which went downhill about 3-6 feet deep and about 1-2 feet wide for both storm sewer runs.
 
IM,

As I understand it, you have (grass?) growing in thin ( = ? inches? ) topsoil over (dune ?) sand.

You are on the right track -- "almost there", as it were , and as we almost always seem to be in trying to accurately predict the behavior of natural systems ;-)

The computational problem you have is not strictly speaking with the ET component. ET is always a negative term in the mass balance equation. You can get to the right answer computationally by refining your conceptual -- and resulting computational -- mass balance model.

Water In -Water Out = +/- Change in Storage.

I presume that your overiding overall objective is to keep soil moisture (generally speaking for most plants) greater than the wilting point.

Check to see whether the roots of the plants you need to irrigate extend significantly through the topsoil. If not, you can make the simplifying assumption that what you are trying to model (= predict) is the amount of water in the topsoil alone or, alternatively to the depth of the roots for shallow-rooted plants.

(((You might also ask yourself why you are growing this grass in this location with all the attendant problems. There are deep-rooted native grasses that would likely do jist fine albeit with a different aesthetic ... http://www.duneland.com/news/2010/02/dunes...-plant-sale.php)))

Then estimate the specific retention ( ~ specific capacity) of the top soil.

You wrote correctly: "This is the factor that I have yet to characterize ". Specific retention is defined as the amount of water retained after a fully saturated porous medium is allowed to drain completely (gravity drainage). This is the maximum amount of water your newly-defined 'system' (the topsoil) can hold. So if the soil specfic retention is say, 1.0", you would take as an initial condition for your model of 1" of water in storage at the end of any rainfall in equal to or greater than 1.0".

You can detemine the specific retention by:

1) saturating the soil in place,
2) allowing it to drain,
3) digging up/coring a cylinder or plug of it with an carefully estimated soil volume prior to disturbance
5) removing (most emergent) vegetation
4) weighing the wet soil,
5) drying it,
6)-reweighing
7) calculating

If you choose a large enough piece with actively growing grass, you can also detemine the wilting point by not (5) drying it, but rather waiting for it to slowly and naturally dry to the point that the grass appears stressed. Weigh it at that point to determne the amount of water that is in your model volume at the 'wilting point',then, as before, 5), dry, 6) re-weigh and calculate to determine specific capacity.

Hope This Helps ... Marc
hult at hydrologist dot com

Marc,

The above definitely helped - a lot. You've managed to reduce the water balance equations to a simple method that even a Caveman EE can understand. I also like the suggestion for determining the plant "wilt point". The two measurements combined should serve to bound my calculations.

Thank you for taking the "magic" out of one biological system for me,

IM
 
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