Homeseer and HAI

[programmergeek]

I have gone down this HAI road with several installs and now with the ipad, iphone nad all these cheaper touch options comming out I have a number of requests to put some sort of real web interface on it. WL3 is just not cutting it especally on the larger installs where we have a bunch of buttons I need customised screens and more orginised programming.

So I am looking for options, the HAI $3500 touch screen is not a option with $500 ipads out there now.

I found Homeseer and it seems to be the answer they are much better in the interface area and organising the programming.

My question is I don't want to switch away from HAI but I have 3 people screaming for better solutions ASAP.

Homeseer can not answer the compatibility issues with HAI there last plug in is quite old and had issues with the lighting. Anyone using the two systems together and can you explain the bugs to me if any. Am I going down the right road here.

I have 2 more HAI installs planned I may switch them to ELK is elk and homseer a good combanation?

 

[Neurorad]

Have you considered CQC? Elve/J9? mControl? Cortexa?

I know Cortexa has an iphone app.

What about just a stand-alone Elk M1? I don't know what's going on with the eKeypad iphone app, haven't read much about it in a while, but I know it's been around at least a year.

Sounds like you need a proven iphone app solution.

I wonder when the Elk M1 Platinum will be released...just starting a rumor...

Since you're officially a pro installer, you could consider RTI + Elk/DSC. Walk into some local electronics distributor stores, and see what they carry. AVAD, ADI, etc.

 

[Dean Roddey]

I think it is probably a bit of a mistake to assume that iPads are going to be sufficient as your primary automation touch screen interface. It probably still makes a lot of sense to have a hardwired, always on, wall mounted touch panel somewhere. If the security alarm goes off, and you can't find your iPad or the batteries are dead or it's running some other program and you have to get out of that and start up the automation interface, that's probably not good.

Though, as mentioned, there are far less expensive ways to have a wall mounted touch screen interface, with software based systems, and with vastly more real estate and far more flexibility to customize.

 

[Rupp]

I have gone down this HAI road with several installs and now with the ipad, iphone nad all these cheaper touch options comming out I have a number of requests to put some sort of real web interface on it. WL3 is just not cutting it especally on the larger installs where we have a bunch of buttons I need customised screens and more orginised programming.

So I am looking for options, the HAI $3500 touch screen is not a option with $500 ipads out there now.

I found Homeseer and it seems to be the answer they are much better in the interface area and organising the programming.

My question is I don't want to switch away from HAI but I have 3 people screaming for better solutions ASAP.

Homeseer can not answer the compatibility issues with HAI there last plug in is quite old and had issues with the lighting. Anyone using the two systems together and can you explain the bugs to me if any. Am I going down the right road here.

I have 2 more HAI installs planned I may switch them to ELK is elk and homseer a good combanation?

Did you ask this on the HomeSeer message board?

 

[pete_c]

I have both HSPro and HAI OPII. The OPII is plug and play. You are right that the interface to HSPro is old. I schedule primary lighting events and security events with the OPII. Secondarily I do more detailed events with the HSPro.

 

[programmergeek]

I am not assuming that ipads will be the primary and only control, reliability has not been proven. Basically the standard install right now I put regular keypads by the door and ideally some sort of touch panel in the kitchen or common areas this way if a camera gets action it can switch to it. I do see wall mounted ipads in the future, heck I'm considering building a frame and a power supply for them myself like the pronto has from Worthington, although I don't have a ipad yet. I totally agree you need mounted controls. People just really like the wireless stuff and my issue is I on these custom installs people are using there iphones, blackberries and other things more and more now and that is not going to change. I also wind up with ton of buttons for custom functionally and not all of them you want everyone to have access to or be able to hit easily. After I do an install I am having more people bringing me pics of crestron systems and high end custom touch panels and asking why there system doesn't look like that any why a ipad is $500 and I charge $3k for a touch pad. Not good for business in fact it is just down right bad. Now I am scrambling for a nice looking solution to tie to HAI.

I did not post on the homeseer board but I spoke to the them extensivly and they don't really support the HAI interface any more or plan to do any work on it. They also did say it has some lighting bugs.

 

[programmergeek]

Pete I know lighting is a issue with HS Pro, have you considered jsut changing all the switches to vinilla UPB with upstart and using HSPro for everything?

I really do like the system and the pro 100 boxes use no power or moving parts also intergrate with the energy deticitive products to monitor solar and power and has RSS feeds so I think you can do some nice screens.

Besides lighting what other issues have you had?

 

[pete_c]

I purchased a couple of older HAI touchscreens and they do provide a smaller TS interface (no bells and whistles) to my HAI panel. Personally l like smaller 9" and less TS's than larger 12"-17" TS's. I could envision a 5.7" screen that you could customize being an optimal solution.

Personally think the keypad/1 /wireless TS approach would work for you.

I have no comments on the HAI/HS interconnectivity (better if I just don't say anything relating to this).

I did try the Myro interface - its plan and simple and yet locks up and loses its configuration on alternate boot ups (so that is currently not being considered). Not worth the asking price (considering the "issues" with it).

Pete I know lighting is a issue with HS Pro, have you considered jsut changing all the switches to vinilla UPB with upstart and using HSPro for everything?

No. I don't want to do that.

 

[pete_c]

programmergeek -

I'm at the HA evolution stage today where I really don't care about my lighting other than it going on. The same with the HVAC. Thus the connections to the OPII panel. I want my HSPro to do "other" things these days.

1 - video security events tied to emails etc - that are much more detailed than what the OPII can do today.
2 - screen scraps of CNN and BBC
3 - sprinkler system (for now) - working on the "what if I died scenario - WAF stuff" now....
4 - all of my 1-wire connections.
this list goes on and on. Even more now that I have Z-Wave and UPB "online" concurrently with same on OPII.

I never had any real lighting issues with HSPro other than typical software/HW type stuff.

My issues were always wanting a plain interface that worked to my HAI OPII panel. Ideally if my HSPro could read my HW PIR's in real time / HVAC in real time / Lighting events in real time I wouldn't have any concerns - but it doesn't.

 

[Brian Yokum]

programmergeek,

Have you investigated the HAI OmniTouch 5.7e with Automation Studio? This should give you the customization that you are looking for far less than $3,500.

HAI Snap-Link for iPhone will be available in June. This gives a nice, clean interface for iPhone, iPod Touch, and iPad.

 

[JonW]

HAI Snap-Link for iPhone will be available in June. This gives a nice, clean interface for iPhone, iPod Touch, and iPad.

Any word on what the pricing for this is going to be?

 

[Brian Yokum]

HAI Snap-Link for iPhone will be available in June. This gives a nice, clean interface for iPhone, iPod Touch, and iPad.

Any word on what the pricing for this is going to be?

$49.99

 

[programmergeek]

Yes the trouble is I am getting feedback that people just want to use there iphone, ipad, blackberry and although you offer a solution for them it is not customizable. People seem to want wireless hence the big price tag. Since I also am a Philips dealer I have tried the pronto with no success it is just to slow. I can put in touch pads, but if they own ipads they don’t want to go buy something else at 4X the cost especially since the ipad does more and they now have a wall dock for it. I am getting beat up here because people see these great interfaces and I can’t do them with HAI. I have 1 customer now that is demanding I take the HAI system out and put an elk m1 in which we will do so he can use homeseer or similar. Really if the homeseer interface worked I think it would solve a lot of my problems because they do a lot of things that HAI can’t. But I lie the reliability of the HAI.
For example here is one situation I have. A customer has an attic fan, to turn it on low I turn on relay 1 to turn it on high I need to turn on relay 1 and 2. If I turn on really 2 alone it is not good, could burn out the fans. I made buttons for them but when they use wl3 or the keypad the button is 40 buttons down and not convent to get to. Also I have several people in the family try to turn on the fan via the unit’s page since it shows up there and turning on relay 2 alone is bad but there is no way to prevent this unless I write a program.
I really just need a customizable wl3 solution. That can display rss feeds like whether and display house status.
Also the voice is another pain it sound ruff and can not say all the messages I need it to. This has been a problem on almost every install. For example I like to set it so when motion is detection in the main hall it tells the residents to take the garbage out on garbage day. But you can't say that “garbage†is not in the list of words. It is also a huge problem for people that come from England and other countries that don't quite say things with the same vocabulary we have.
I could go on and on but at the end of the day I need to do what the customer wants. So if they want it to say something I need to do it. Or if they want to see there email and home security status and have a couple of buttons on there blackberry I need to do it. I really don’t want to go down the Creston road either I just have to many products.

 

[Steve]

I have 1 customer now that is demanding I take the HAI system out and put an elk m1 in which we will do so he can use homeseer or similar. Really if the homeseer interface worked I think it would solve a lot of my problems because they do a lot of things that HAI can’t. But I lie the reliability of the HAI.

First, changing the HAI out with an Elk is not going to solve your problems. As much as you may want to try you have to remember that the Omni and M1 are security systems with automation features. In order to be rock solid for security and UL they have to be somewhat static and limited. They are awesome and do alot but they will never be able to do everything you want. If you require all the other bells and whistles like you describe then you need to supplement with a software system that provides those. Take your pick - CQC - Homeseer, Elve, etc... You can set them up on a small dedicated box like an Atom and set them up to do all your ancillary functions. You can use their touchscreen builders to make nice screens that do anything you want on regular touchscreens or iPhones/iPads. All of these software packages should have robust HAI drivers although I can't directly speak for anything but CQC. If you were to interact with my touchscreens or iPhones you could not tell if you were talking to the software or the panel since its all integrated and that's what the customer wants - one interface and they don't care what's on the back end. Between an OPII and CQC the sky is really the limit.

If HAI is your specialty for panels, then evaluate some of the software that works well with it and become an expert at it as well. Then when you have a large install where the customer wants it all you can choose panel, software or both to meet their needs. But I'm afraid without a software package of some sort for the extras you will never be able to meet all of your customers needs.

Now HAI can do alot of this with their touchscreens and Automation Studio but as you are finding many people don't want to spend that kind of money on their custom touchscreens when they already have iPhones and iPads. If this new Snaplinc for the iPhone/Pad is anything like eKeypad for the Elk then it should help bridge the gap some.

 

[programmergeek]

I hope the new HAI software helps. Custom screens is what I need that will help some of the pain. I will have to look into CQC more I spent some time on there site but I didn't get anywhere there where no screen shots or even a manual I could find. unfortinally the more time I am behind the PC the less time I am spending making money and installing HT and security systems so I need simple solutions which is why I liked HAI they use to have everything figured out and where the best show in town. But ever since wl3 they don't seem to be keeping up the pc end, I can't tell you howm many hp home severs I have had to replace and blow up.

I found homeseer through a client and the HAI interface is not solid enought for me to feel comfortable with even the guy that wrote it says so I spoke to him HAI just does some wierd stuff that makes interfacing hard. Both homeseer and elk state they work well together so that is why the one job is getting switched I am not happay about it but it is what the guy wants and I want to keep people happy even if it is on my dime.