How do Elk/Omni stack up against legacy products (like Silent Knight)

[ghurty]

I was telling a friend (who is a fire alarm professional) about HA and especially ELK and HAI Omni. And that how you may be getting more for your money with these systems then the old legacy systems.

Was I right about that?

Not counting the ability to tie into a HA system, are ELK and Omni better products then the legacy devices? He for example usually installs Silent Knight.

How does ELK/Omni stand up to it? In regards to features and price.

This is out of my skill set, but just wondering now that it came up in conversation.


Thanks

 

[Del91574]

SK hasn't made an alarm panel in about 15+ years. -_-
As an aside, SK used to have what was called "firmware of the day" when I worked at Notifier and some of my coworkers would help out the SK support guys....SK seemed to push their panels/software through with all sorts of bugs, then need to be constantly patched.

Residentially, I typically install the Honeywell/Ademco Vista panels or the Elk panels. HAI is only really used when needed because of overall cost vs. features, as well as being a more "closed" platform for items like RF and tiered based on the panel vs. expandability and cost, where Elk has 2 panels that can expand (with some exceptions) to pretty much the same platform.

Pricewise, as a pro installer/dealer, once you start to load up a Ademco panel with expanders, etc. pricing becomes pretty close to an M1G with minor expansion, if any, but the functionality is night and day when you start factoring in the rules. Elk is very similar to the Ademco platform, modular and all their devices are compatible across their platforms, which are really the same panel, just slightly different hardware.

I can't justify using a HAI for a low end install because their platform is just too limited in the expandability and having 3 platforms, 2 that are hobbled out of the box for expansion unless you buy the Omnipro.

A M1G kit loaded up is half the cost of an OPII, though when you add the serials and ethernet to make them more apple to apple, the price difference isn't that great, the only difference I've run across is the memory space for logic equations/automation events.

In the end, the main difference between a "conventional" burg/fire system and a platform like the Elk and HAI is the flexibility of what you can do as far as controlling/interfacing to other systems and devices, which is easier on a "platform" than a conventional, which generally needs a lot more hardware and the end result isn't as integrated and slick.

 

[ghurty]

Thanks for the reply.

Not that I doubt you, but I was just in a building built in the last five years and they had what appeared to be a Silent Knight system (even though I did see the words ELK written by hand on the control box).

Do these systems even do burglar alarms?

I will see if it possible for me to take a picture of what is inside the box.


Thanks

 

[Del91574]

They aren't security panels, and the picture shown is of a FA panel only. SK used to make burglar alarm/combination panels back in the day, like the Regency panels....but that was 15+ years ago, prior to Honeywell purchasing the brand and resurrecting the name as a fire panel. They were long defunct as a security panel prior to that. Also, they had their own quirks...such as a 15K EOLR, I saw lots of circuits that ended up rotting out due to corrosion from the loop voltage drop.

Not saying you couldn't supervise a point or two, such as a roof hatch or cabinet tamper, they are not intended to be used as security panels/alarm panels with "arm/disarm" capabilities, not to mention the bulk of FA panels run 24VDC, which would smoke most powered alarm components, then factor in some panels do not have a digital communicator or IPDACT built in....

Commercial fire panels and burg panels are an entirely different world compared to a HA or cross platform control.

 

[ghurty]

Got it. Here are some more pics from the inside.

I see it uses ELK Batteries.

Quick question, could the ELK m1 Gold do everything this box could do? If yes, is it as legal fir commercial installs?

Like I said, this is way out of my league, just trying to open the eyes of a friend of mine.


Thanks

 

[Del91574]

You're comparing apples to grapes, completely different products and applications. You're looking at an addressable fire alarm vs. a burglar alarm.

The battery part is like asking if a Ford Focus uses Shell gas, can it tow a 10K pound trailer and haul a cord of wood?

The M1 carries listings as do other panels, it depends on what the AHJ will allow, but the minimum for the panel should be a listing for UL commercial burglary.

 

[ghurty]

Thank you for all your answers.

When I saw the Elk batteries I thought that maybe they manufacturer the control board for Silent Knight.

You said the silent knight was an 'addressable fire system ' while the ELK was a burgarler system. But can the ELK be used as a 'addressable fire system ' when building codes require one? I just think it would be more cost effective to have one combined system then two separate ones. The or is it that the silent knight type system has certain necessary fire options that the ELK can't keep up with.
I just like to know why I don't see combined systems floating around more.

Thanks

Sent from my SCH-I510 using Tapatalk

 

[Del91574]

A commercial fire alarm or combination panel with a SLC is an entirely different entity than a conventional burglar alarm panel, combined with the different codes that need to be met....UL, FM, as well as the AHJ. Some will not allow a combination system and specifically require separate panels.

There are things that the more advanced addressable panels do that a simple burglar alarm panel can't, no matter how "advanced" it is.

The SK fire panels are pretty general in capabilities, but the larger panels have logic that can be programmed, with the ability to network multiple panels together to operate as a single "panel" as well as run boolean logic equations to perform complex actions....floor above/below, multiple detector cooperation, elevator recall, shutdown AHU's and whatever else, as well as have 20-30 different fire zone types and software zones as well.

The big thing is you can't compare items that are completely different in nature and function.

A simple combination panel would be like a Ademco V-32, V-128FBP or V-250 FBP and then run devices on their multiplex loop for addressable, but the majority of combination panels are limited to their application and abilities compared to a larger fire panel.

Apples to grapes.