flamer here - smarthome never told me this - if this is too revolutionary to do what they advertise, i wish they would post that on their web site
odd that insteon evokes so much passion without any reason
Insteon - new users' experiences - mine's been pretty good
- Thread starter bbruck
- Start date
odd that insteon evokes so much passion without any reason
You do have a point that these products are marketed and sold to consumers with no warning that they are early adopter products not ready for prime time. I used to be able to buy them at Home Depot but they yanked them early last year.
Sorry Digger, but I have to call a foul on that shot. Many retailers have been yanking items from the shelves in favor of carrying them online. Home Depot carries both Insteon and X10 products online. There's nothing that I can see to indicate that the Insteon products were pulled from shelves due to problems.
I recently found that my Delta "rough-in" shower valves are no longer on the shelves (online only). I certainly hope that doesn't mean that I was an early adopter of their shower valve technology.
Just calling it as I see it,
IM
Foul what? My post was saying HD used to sell them to consumers with no warning that they were for early adopters. Did I say they were pulled for a reason? That is your feeling on it fine but not what I said. Many people keep saying all of the problems with Insteon are ok since they are for early adopters. Where does it say that in the advertising or packaging or instructions?
Joe Consumer goes to HD or online and reads that SH says Insteon is the best thing since sliced bread as far as automated lighting goes. he buys it and has all kinds of probelms and then is told "but you have to expect that being an early adopter". Three or four years now into Insteon everyone is still early adopters? Where does it say that people are buying the products as early adopters?
Sloop has a point
Whoaah dude - the "foul" thing was intended to be tongue-in-cheek (we are coming up on March madness). Sorry you didn't take it that way.
WayneW
Senior Member
I believe that IndyMike was calling foul on Digger's claim that HD "yanked them early last year". One could argue that if HD still sells them online, they didn't "yank" them, they made "a marketing choice". 
WayneW
Senior Member
And in all fairness, somebody at SmartLabs needs a dictionary to look up the word "release" and it's tenses.
http://www.smarthome.com/pr09-03.html
The expected availability dates range from 03/23 to 04/30 to 06/30.
http://www.smarthome.com/pr09-03.html
NONE of those items are in-stock and shipping today, so how are they "released"?
The expected availability dates range from 03/23 to 04/30 to 06/30.
bbruck
Member
Amazing how topics related to Insteon seem to suffer from Cocoon's corollary to Godwin's Law. (Godwin's Law, if you recall, states: "As a Usenet discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Nazis or Hitler approaches one." - Wikipedia). Not sure exactly what the corollary is, but it probably has something to do with "As a Cocoon discussion involving Insteon grows longer, the probability of it morphing to a discussion that flames the technology and its manufacturer approaches one."
I brought up the "early adopter" warning, but never said anything about "not ready for prime time."
There are plenty of threads here that beat up insteon and SH; It'd sure be great if we could keep this one to a relatively civil discussion about new users' experiences - things to like and dislike - things to know about and watch for - without having to degenerate into trashing the technology and its manufacturer.
I brought up the "early adopter" warning, but never said anything about "not ready for prime time."
There are plenty of threads here that beat up insteon and SH; It'd sure be great if we could keep this one to a relatively civil discussion about new users' experiences - things to like and dislike - things to know about and watch for - without having to degenerate into trashing the technology and its manufacturer.
I said not ready for prime time as they still dont have the full protocal implemented in all of their products (but they are working on that).
So how long will users be considered early adopters in your opinion? Another year or two? Five? Insteon has been out for almost 5 years now right.
bbruck
Member
Well, actually I sort of think that all of us using *any* of the HA technologies are early adopters. (Possibly the super duper expensive stuff doesn't qualify for this - dunno.)
But as I read through Cocoon, SH, and other HA forums, I read about a lot of hobbyists who, like myself, worry about the WAF because none of the technologies are rock-solid.
I see folks self-programming their sprinkler controllers because there isn't a way to integrate great smart controllers like SmartLine with HA.
I see folks experimenting with super expensive light bulbs, and trying to make CFs work with their HA dimmers - because the technologies haven't quite meshed yet.
I see folks going into this - like myself - looking for ways to integrate lighting, climate control, survellience, irritation, and security - to make a "smart house" - but having to cobble things together no matter what technologies they use.
So I don't see Insteon as early adopter technology; I see the whole HA family of technologies as appropriate only for early adopters.
I'll feel that we are out of the early adopter stage when my wife would feel comfortable managing our HA-enabled house if I die; if my wife, in fact, would see a new HA-enabled house as a convenience rather than a time- and money-sink; if she didn't see this as an expensive hobby of mine; and if the term WAF disappeared from our dialogs.
I love it, but the whole enterprise is for early adopters.
Just my opinion. YMMV
But as I read through Cocoon, SH, and other HA forums, I read about a lot of hobbyists who, like myself, worry about the WAF because none of the technologies are rock-solid.
I see folks self-programming their sprinkler controllers because there isn't a way to integrate great smart controllers like SmartLine with HA.
I see folks experimenting with super expensive light bulbs, and trying to make CFs work with their HA dimmers - because the technologies haven't quite meshed yet.
I see folks going into this - like myself - looking for ways to integrate lighting, climate control, survellience, irritation, and security - to make a "smart house" - but having to cobble things together no matter what technologies they use.
So I don't see Insteon as early adopter technology; I see the whole HA family of technologies as appropriate only for early adopters.
I'll feel that we are out of the early adopter stage when my wife would feel comfortable managing our HA-enabled house if I die; if my wife, in fact, would see a new HA-enabled house as a convenience rather than a time- and money-sink; if she didn't see this as an expensive hobby of mine; and if the term WAF disappeared from our dialogs.
I love it, but the whole enterprise is for early adopters.
Just my opinion. YMMV
I dont find any of my current HA products to be any sort of early adopter status at all. Everything I currently have just works. No intermittancy, no device failures, no headaches at all (since I dumped Insteon at home). Zero problems with WAF since the Insteon was ripped out last summer. In fact she barely even mentions it unless she occasionally asks me to add something (yes she wants a new feature now and then). Why the 180 degree turn around? The products I have WORK reliably compared to SH Insteon products failing constantly.
I have a lot of products from various manufacturers but mainly ELK Products and Simply Automated as far as quantity. I have not had a single product failure from either mfg. and a lot of the ELK products is about 4 years old now (and not had to replace any hardware because an older craplinc is no longer supported... Sloop I owe you a quarter for using your term). Even the ELK batteries still test fine after years (although I expect to have to replace some of the original batteries this year just to be sure).
I would also not consider HAI or other similar mfg's as early adopter products at all. They make well designed, quality, well supported products.
Home Automation has been around for decades. It is becoming more popular as products are more intergreted and more affordable.
But you are definitely entitled to your opinion.
Steve
Senior Member
Personally, I think the term 'early adopter' is wrong here. I could say almost all of the things quoted (not picking, just an example) could be said about a pc buff, would that then mean we are early adopters of a pc? I would agree we are still relatively early in the integration stages of total home automation, but I do believe that each individual component, taken by itself, ought to work as described and advertised. If a company says a product is going to do xyz and I pay good money for it, I certainly expect that product to do that. If it doesn't it is a problem with the company/product/advertising/representation or whatever. Now, if that product by itself does all of those things nicely by itself, but you have trouble making it do other things as part of the whole, when tied in with other products, then you have an integration problem which can be contributed to being an 'early adopter' in the whole scope of automation. I pretty much guarantee you if you paid the $$$ for say a Crestron or Elan type system, you would not have problems like in the quote. Ask any pro installer or one of their customers and they probably don't even know what the term WAF means because those systems are tigthly integrated and do just work. So, my twist on it is that its more of an integration thing when talking about early adoption, but the individual products themselves ought to work. Short of that, there's a problem.
WayneW
Senior Member
Nope, Insteon items first shipped in May 2005 (ahead of schedule), which makes it less than 4 years old.
http://www.cocoontech.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=1525
http://www.cocoontech.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=1959
Ok 4 years I wasnt sure...... so I guess everyone is still an early adopter. So is everyone with a broadband internet connection to I guess.
WayneW
Senior Member
Digger, quit twisting everyone's words around. I simply corrected a fact and made no comment about early adopter. This thread was civil until recently.
