Legacy phone wiring to Cat5E - PoE?

[pete_c]

I'm thinking of doing a PoE wired connection using 10 year old telco wiring and wondering if its feasible?


I have a telco wiring "cluster" of more than 8 wires running from the telco box to the wiring closet in the house. Its maybe 75 feet to 100 feet of more than 8 wires that telephone company installed around 2000 when the house was rebuilt.

I am no longer using a legacy copper telephone line since the installation of FIOS. I do believe though that the FIOS telephone circuit was installed outside and connected to a pair of those wires for "retrofitting" the new and the old telephone lines.

That said I'm thinking that I still have at least 8 wires (4 pairs) available in the legacy telco box (there might be more) that run from the box to the wiring closet. I want to install a poe IP camera outside on that side of the house using the legacy cabling for an outdoor weather camera.

The camera will be mounted on the OTA antenna mast in the vicinity. There is a lightning arrestor already on the RG-6 there. I want to protect the POE camera also from lightning as that is an issue there. The topology would be something like the following:

POE camera==> Cat5E ==> lightning protection ==> legacy telco wiring => wiring closet to poe injector ==> network switch.

Would it be better to just go with a wireless IP camera and use the telco wires for power to the camera instead? (this would be easier)

In addition to the legacy telco cabling there are two RG-6 cables; one being utilized today for the OTA and one being utiized today for the FIOS connection to the wiring closet. (so today can't utilize these for anything else).

 

[wuench]

If it is Cat3, Cat3 is rated at 10Mbps and can handle the POE (Type-1 ONLY).

If it is not Cat3, or a bunch of separate wires and it is 24Ga, 1 pair should still be able to handle POE Type-1 but YMMV on the amount of bandwidth you'll be able to achieve if you try to combine them since they won't be twisted-pair so may have signal loss/interference. Your best bet would be to terminate each side and then try to run a bandwidth test and look for any physical errors on both ends, that will tell you what you can do with it network-wise. I assume these are not daisy chained through wall jacks, etc. The other concern would be whether the wire can carry the power without fire risk if using POE and NOT cat3.

 

[tmbrown97]

It definitely depends on what type of wire that is, and as Wuench stated, if it has any splits. You wouldn't want to use it if there's any daisy chaining going on. Unless it's Cat5 I wouldn't try to use it for data without using a VDSL converter which is pricey; but if it's a straight through and you do the math on voltage draw, combining pairs as needed, you should be fine using it for power.

If you don't want to eat up your wifi bandwidth, I've had decent experience with some of the Lorex wireless cameras - such as this one. It doesn't use the wifi bandwidth and it doesn't interfere.

 

[pete_c]

Thanks guys.

I never paid attention to what type of cabling it was. Its more than 4 pairs of wires and appears thinner than regular cat5e 24 guage wire; but its been 12 years since I've punched it down to the telephone block. Its a single run from one side of the house to the other side (where the wiring closet is). The path goes into the attic from the side of the house then down to the wiring closet.

I was there during construction (~2000) and there when the telco person was connecting original telco lines (used it for DSL at the time). I stopped him from doing any work when he started to tell me about daisychaining the telephone wires.

I personally terminated only two wires to the telephone wiring block and used cat5e for all of the analogue runs to the rest of the phone lines in the house.

I can run a separate pair of wires for power if I go wireless using the FIOS configuration into the house next to the telco box. The camera will be about 50 or so feet from salt water so I am not sure how long it may last.

 

[pete_c]

This endeavor is leading to a weather station / weather cam installation in the house in Florida.

I have not yet installed a weather station / web cam yet in FL. Will test for network connectivity initially and may use externally connected power as that is available where I want to put the camera (instead of PoE). 10Mb would work; but I get 100Mb that'll be better. Power will come from the FIOS box going into the house. (I can put another PS inside and use the cable run outside for the camera).

The weather station will most likely be installed in the next week or so. It is wireless with a battery. It is the Fine Offset type. It was cheap at $66 USD and I doubt that it'll last there but maybe a few months (guessing right now). I've had it installed here now for a few months though and its done well. It did survive the almost 40-50 mph winds we had here a few days back.

The IP camera will be tested here in the midwest first (may buy two of them); then eventually in Florida. I have issues in Florida with lightning. So a camera with network / power might be an issue if its mounted high near the weather station. The OTA antenna mast that I want to install the weather station though is using a mast bracket under the eave of the roof; so I may be able to mount the camera in the vicinity under the eave and away from the mast some. (roof is all tile so its kind of off limits to do anything with).

Been back and forth with a vendor on his new 1.3 Mp wired and configured for PoE IP camera which he sells for $150. Off the shelf he has a 6mm lens on it and I asked him if he would refit it with a 3-4mm lens. So far he said yes.

Thinking of trying the camera here in the midwest first replacing my just installed not happy with weathercam. Today the camera is using a cat5e balun for the analog power and video. Its about 150 feet of cable. Going to try this IP camera in its place in the next few weeks.

I've not seen an IP camera like this before. It has one lens and a whole separate section for the LED illumination (which I can turn on or off).

 

[wuench]

Do you have a link to the camera info?

 

[pete_c]

Yes, here is the link. Its actually cheaper than $150. Taking a chance here and doing a back and forth thing with the vendor. I do not know anything right now about the quality / or the vendor selling it. Kind of going this way blindly.

This one is being sold as an outdoor IP camera at $136.99 USD with free shipping. The initial test in the MW will be to mount it under the eave on my second story house where the current web cam is at. So it will be a bit protected. The vendor said its "weather proof"; not sure though it has an IP65 rating though or what rating the enclosure has as its not documented.

- Model
OM13
- Image Compression
H.264&JPEG
- Image Sensor
1/3" 1 megapixel CMOS
- Lens
3.6MM/ 6MM/ 8MM/ 12MM /16MM optional
- ICR function
Support,36pcsф8 IR leds（3.6MM/6MM）
Support,20pcsф8+4pcsф25 IR leds（8MM/12MM/16MM）
-Minimum illumination
[email protected] ,0Lux@IR-cut On
- IR Distance
5-20meters
- Sensitivity
- 1.0V/lux-sec (550nm)
- Video Resolution
Primary stream:25fps @ 1280 x 720,1024x768,800x592,800x450, 650x480,640x368, 480x368,480x272
- Video Bit rate
256 Kbps – 8 Mbps
- Audio Input
Support Microphone Input
Audio Compression
PCMU/PCMA
- Network Connector
10M/100Mbps self-adaption , RJ45
- Network Protocol
TCP, UDP, IP, HTTP, DHCP, RTP, RTSP, FTP, SMTP, DNS, DDNS, NTP,ICMP, IGMP, ARP,SIP
- DDNS
YES
- Working Condition.
Temperature:-10°C ~ +50°C Humidity:10%-90%
- Power Supply
DC12V

http://www.ali2.com/...mer-ip-cam.html

This one is being sold for $149.00 with free shipping. (its a 720TVL though its a good price).

http://www.ali2.com/...-IP-Camera.html