New Z-wave controller

[JimMurphy]

The Oomi system is using 5th generation Z-wave technology.  They also support Wi-fi, although some people are moaning as they are just using wireless N rather than the newer and faster AC for the wi-fi.  There is also support for Bluetooth.  Talking of videos, they recently made one demonstrating controlling Nest thermostats and Philips Hue devices via wi-fi, so hopefully the Oomi system can also be used with the various new IoT gadgets that are being released.  To provide support it is a case of Oomi or some other smart developer writing a widget that provides a communication path between a chosen IoT device and the Oomi Android-based Touch.  It also isn't clear if Oomi has the new chip that allows IPv6 support to allow for better future IoT support.
 
The Oomi discussions have been quite lively and it looks like Oomi may set-up a forum so the supporters can discuss how to connect things up etc.  It seems that the buyers of the Oomi system vary from total newbies who haven't been involved with automation or Z-wave right up to people who have an existing complete Z-wave network and want to replace their current controller with the Oomi.
 
Oomi can access the internet (Oomi streamer etc), but doesn't need cloud access, which a weakness with some of the other Z-wave controllers.  So if your ADSL internet connection goes down you cannot stream movies, but you still have full access to control your alarm and have access to your home.  There may be a slight grey area around the Oomi cameras, as these have microSD card storage and you can access them via your IOS or Android smartphone.  If you want to display any camera feed on your TV, however, this is done by the Oomi streamer.  I'm not 100% sure if the streamer will display videos from the cameras to the TV if the internet is down.
 
So the Oomi campaign is in the final day and their offer on Indiegogo closes in under 9 hours.  They are just short of $1.7M in pre-orders - they did go through the $1.7M mark a few days ago, but Indiegogo cancelled 2 or 3 $34,000 distributor packages for some reason!  Oomi said in 1 of their ads that you could save up to $310 by purchasing in this campaign.  This makes me think that the $699 platinum may retail for over $1000 once it becomes readily available in October.

I watched the videos. Pretty slick family of gadgets. Hub is not just a hub but chock full of sensors. Its styling is unobtrusive.
 
The plug's visible feedback is a nice touch. Sure seems easy to setup. Tapping the controller to a gadget serves to discover/register it. Plug didn't even need to be powered to discover it.
 
They mentioned "intelligence" (i.e. more than a remote-control for gadgets) but no meaty demo of it.
 
Only thing I didn't care for is the way scenes are defined. Despite the fact a lamp had already been registered, you have to tap it again to include it in a scene. You want that same lamp to be included in another scene? Tap again. You want to include all lights in the house in a scene? Be prepared to walk around tapping all your lights. Perhaps the next version will allow you to tap a gadget once and then re-use it to create scenes.
 
Does it need cloud access? I didn't see that mentioned in the videos. What RF magic is it using? zwave? zigbee?

 

[pete_c]

@Jim,
 

I have ordered the platinum package, but the drawback is I need to wait until October for the kit to be delivered.  Oomi have teamed up with Aeon Labs who are making their accessories, which seem to have very good form factors and feature sets.  The pre-production pricing is very competitive and Z-wave seems to supporting many new products now.  It is getting easier to integrate alarm systems and CCTV cameras with home automation into a single system that is relatively easy to install.

 
You have ordered the Oomi Platinum kit at $799 USD.  The automation appears to be based heavily on Z-Wave (Aeon Labs).
 
Personally here automation is a hobby and I play with and use automation. 
 
What I use works and what I play with works most of the time.
 
I see the Oomi system as a very high priced solution to automation/security with major dependancies on the magic of wireless which has been tweaked over the years but its still just wireless RF. (802.11X, Bluetooth, Z-Wave et al). 
 
I like the interface and the simplicity of it.   Let's say its worth $1000. 
 
I do not want to sound like a debbie downer even though I am right now.
 
What makes the Oomi system different from the rest of the newbee automation products out there?
 
How would you personally sell it / endorse it? 

 

[JimMurphy]

@Pete
I bought the platinum kit at $738 ($699 plus $39 international shipping).  Oomi raised the prices of all their kits by $100 after the Indiegogo campaign closed, so that is why the platinum kits are now $799.  I also bought 2 external sirens at $84 ($69 plus $15 shipping).  So the Oomi controller is the called the Cube and this has more processing power than the Micasa Verde and something about the same as the Fibaro Home Center 2.  When I looked at the Oomi system it had the following components:

• Cube controller - this also has a built-in camera, microphone, speaker, IR blaster etc.  Could be worth $250
• Touch screen - 7" touch screen with some tactile button on the side to control TV etc.  This is an Android device that will be used instead of using a smartphone and has a docking station/charger.  Could be worth $150
• Streamer to stream video/music to a TV.  It also doubles as a video sender for the Oomi cams.  Oomi were offering this for $99 during their campaign
• Oomi air that connects into the back of the cube to monitor air pollution and VOC.  TBH I wasn't that bothered with this, but the platinum kit included this.  If they would let me, I would exchange the Oomi air for a 2nd Oomi streamer.  Could be worth $75
• 9 mixed Aeon accessories that are customized with the Oomi NFC sticker.  Looking at Amazon the Aeon accessories sell for $49.95 each and I suspect Oomi will sell their accessories for the same price.

Adding all the parts up comes to comes to just over $1000, so buying the kit for $699 made sense to me, as long as the system does what I think it will do.  I cannot endorse the kit until I actually take take delivery of it and see what it is capable of and see how well the user-interface works.
 
As you say there are loads of new automation and IoT products coming out, so what made me go with Oomi?  I did some research on the Fantem/Oomi CEO Winston Cheng.  He has worked for Zensys (the makers of Z-wave) for 2 years and was the VP of Aeon Labs for 6 years, so he has over 8 years of solid experience of playing with Z-wave.  To me this takes a lot of the risk out of going down the crowdfunding route, as most of the Oomi accessories are already available through Aeon and Oomi already have prototype Cube and Touch hardware and can demonstrate basic functionality in their videos.  Hopefully they will come up with a stable firmware load that gives a reasonable user interface experience before they ship the kit in October.

 

[wkearney99]

So October came and went, now they're showing January 2016.  

 

[JimMurphy]

Oomi are still saying they are going to start shipping the kit this month to the original backers.  The January shipping is for people who place a new order now.
 
The timescales that Oomi were working to were a bit ambitious.  It looks like they had most of the hardware ready, but they delayed releasing their kit to everybody because they felt that they didn't have enough time to develop their UI/UX software.
 
Oomi did initially offer for me to be one of their UI/UX beta testers and I would have had the kit shipped out in October.  They then said they could only release a single frequency and had decided to concentrate on the US frequency rather than Europe or Australia.  This means that all the Oomi beta testers will be from the USA/Canada and any other countries that use the US Z-wave frequency. 

 

[jdk972003]

You know I have been testing the Smartthings Hub this week due to its Echo integration.
 
I REALLY wish Smartthings had waited to release their second hub, their new app is literally like trying to find your way through a maze.  They wanted unique terminology to separate themselves from the pack, and now they have stupid stuff like a home picture that doesn't bring you to the home screen.  Its a real cluster.  And oh the cloud based issues....
 
Example:
I hooked up 1 z-wave outlet to a single lamp.  That's all.  Clicked "on"...worked great.  Adjusted brightness, worked great.  Clicked off, again great. After some setup, Said "Alexa, turn the desk lamp on".  That worked too!.  
 
Next day...
 
Click "on".  Nothing.  45 minutes later in the middle of a movie, lamp turns on.
 
So much for cloud based service.  But man I liked the direct control via Alexa.

 

[LarrylLix]

Many of us are trying desperately to avoid cloud dependence in the HA world. The google voice fails constantly on my mobile Android device because I am not in the megopolis at the time.
 
Nothing like cool gadgets that you can't rely on.

 

[wkearney99]

Yeah, the ST2 app is kinda clunky.  I've been mucking about with it and a Wink.  They both offer a similar degree of suck-age when it comes to cloud dependency and slow performance because of it.  But at least the ST hub has better development features, as opposed to, well, NONE for the Wink.  Different target markets, I suppose.  
 
I'm likewise delighted with using my Echo.  Haven't done much with lighting other than playing with some Hue Blooms.  My lighthing is all Lutron RA2 and they've done nothing to extend integration with it.  Supposedly a hub's coming in February but I'm not holding my breath.  I have done some hacks emulating Hue devices through it, but nothing reliable yet.
 
The Echo certainly brings to light to new ways to think about how to control home automation.  To me it makes scenes a lot more viable.  As I've never found the limited number of on-wall buttons to ever really be 'enough' to effectively cover how we want to use the spaces.  Lighting scenes, coupled with conditionals like light, day & time, can be a lot more flexible.  "Alexa, set lighting to breakfast" and have it understand that means a certain light level on specific fixtures, influenced by existing daylight conditions.  M-F might mean at the breakfast nook table, but weekends in the dining room.  You obviously can't do that just yet, but soon... perhaps.

 

[wkearney99]

Many of us are trying desperately to avoid cloud dependence in the HA world. The google voice fails constantly on my mobile Android device because I am not in the megopolis at the time.

 
Well, it's not like the coverage at your house is going to be as variable as traveling around with your phone.  I agree it's better to be able to run independently of internet services.  And I'd imagine once the market catches up with Amazon there will be some options for that.  But meanwhile it does go a long way toward demonstrating new ways to approach home automation.  None of this tech hasn't existing before, making it smart, quick and cheap has been a clever move on Amazon's part.

 

[LarrylLix]

Yes, the Echo is an amazing device and a good start to impress and lure more people's wallet into HA.  People interfacing it to the ISY are quite thrilled, so far. IIRC, ISY994i is currently building a direct interface with it as Amazon has let them in with their API. The plot thickens.
 
Meanwhile Nest won't let ISY interface directly to it  because it is a competing load management control device.
 
I had two Winks last year that I got from Christmas requests. After talking to their support, upgrading them, and using their app I relaised they didn't interface with anything despite amazing hardware capabilities. Every cool movie showed pressing the link button on the other manufacturer's hub/bridge. That was the last thing I wanted was another hub talking to a hub talking to a device with possibly a cloud in between acting like fog. They both went back. Now they went bankrupt. Too bad with that potential.

 

[wkearney99]

There's lots of 'old dogs and new tricks' problems with uptake on HA.  Likewise the anti-competition nonsense.  Cue Apple and Homekit for a likely deluge of FUD in the near future...
 
There's no magic to getting in with Amazon and their API, other than talking seriously with their development crew.  Lots of vendors are no doubt taking that route.  There's a LOT more to AWS than most folks realize and Amazon's certainly making pretty good use of it for the Echo.
 
Yeah, my interest in the Wink gizmos was getting at the radios built into them, not necessarily in Wink's software or infrastructure.  I've yet to hack the hardware to add the serial console to allow rooting it.  They didn't go bankrupt, their backer did.  Wink's since been picked up by their hardware vendor.  Time will tell if that helps or not.  But at least they're not wigwag, having never actually shipped anything.  Or Revolv, bought and extinguished.

 

[Dean Roddey]

If you have an automation system that supports both, then there's no problem having them talk to each other. We can do that easily enough.

 

[jdk972003]

I know Dean but...this sounds so stupid but is a huge deal....
 
My wife and I like saying "Alexa...turn on the Desk light."
Adding any additional phrasing in between, such as ...tell house... or anything else breaks the natural fluidity of voice control.  the reason she like sit (and I agree), is all we need to remember is Alexa's name.  Not how to say it or in what order.
 
I know HS is looking into integrating with Alexa at that level, you should touch base with Amazon and do the same.
 
Didn't mean to hijack the thread....sorry about that JimMurphy

 

[wkearney99]

It's worth having a separate thread for Echo skills.  There's an issue with what it takes to be a first tier skill and there's lots of things that would like to grab that spot.  It's kind of both fortunate and unfortunate that there's 1st tier actions because of the pretty immediate amount of potential conflict.

 

[pete_c]

@JimMurphy,
 
I look forward to what you have to say about what you have purchased when you get your product.  (Oomi Platinum kit).
 
Here I sort of did a similiar endeavor voluntarily and accepted products while vivo in hardware design with instructions on mechanisms of the MFG adjustments to the final hardware with the updated firmware stuff (based on an arm based CPU).
 
It did make me get really familiar with the product which talked using multiple wireless radios.  My endeavor here mostly involved only my time and efforts (hardware stuff and firmware stuff and testing stuff) and trying this and that and posting and a bit of managing stuff for newbies (all pro bono).
 
I have dabbled with Z-Wave switching/dimming several lamps, but was looking for a user-friendly controller that could manage a larger Z-wave network.  The MicasaVerde ones were cheap, but didn't seem to have a good user-interface.  The Fibaro Home Center is more powerful and has a great user-interface, but is expensive.  I was toying with the idea of using a Raspberry Pi2 combined with the Razberry Pi Z-Wave add-on as a Z-Wave controller and combine this with a tablet to control the Z-Wave system.  This, however, would have needed loads of programming using Python - a language that I haven't used yet.
 
What are you using relating to Z-Wave switches and control today and are you a happy camper with your dabbling to date with Z-Wave?
 
You mention a user-friendly controller; which one that you have tried to date are you most pleased with?
 
Personally the whole automation market today is changing daily and based on mostly rhetoric relating to what is best or most utilized or easy or cheap. 
 
Have a look at the posts on Reddit / Home Automation.
 
I do not see an end solution (lots of newbie automation "me first" vendors reinventing the wheel stuff) on the near horizon.
 
I mostly prefer to tinker with software with transport to a controller (whatever that is) because it is the fast way to look see the how and what of the different automation protocols for play.