Replacing a pre-wired Honeywell with an Elk

MickeyExplorer

New Member
Hello!  We're building a new house which is almost done, and I want to replace the prewired system (which I did to get the sensor wiring done at build time) with an Elk so I can integrate it with other home automation things.  They wired it up yesterday and here's what I saw:
 
* Above the structured wiring panel, they added a metal enclosure with the Honeywell unit.  
* They combined several sensors per zone (twisting the wires together).  They did label each zone but not each individual wire.
* They added a 2000 ohm resistor right there at the panel for each zone, which according to the sticker on the panel door is what it needs.
 
So here's what i'm thinking after I take possession:
 
* I replace THEIR metal enclosure with the one from the M1 gold kit (my wife would prefer white to their light brown anyway, and I figure the mounting will be easier)
* I get enough M1XIN units to handle each zone individually rather than combining, because that gives me more options when I integrate with other HA stuff.
* The fact they put their resistors at the panel means I can just remove them and tell the ELK not to care about EOL resistors. (Right?)
* I snake cables from the alarm panel down to the structured wiring panel right below it and mount the M1XEP unit in the structured wiring panel.
 
Questions:
* Do my thoughts make sense?  (Am I right about the EOL resistors?)
* How many M1XIN units can you get in the typical M1 Gold enclosure?  I need to get an exact count but it looks to me like there are about 20 sensor wires so I *should* just need one for now.  Will it fit?
* Is there any reason why or why not to put things in the structured wiring panel vs the alarm enclosure?  Right now we're thinking self monitoring but are there rules or guidelines about that?
* If anyone has suggestions on Elk dealers (US, Arizona, if it matters) I'd be happy to take them.  I'm pretty handy with IT stuff so in addition to supplying the units I might just need the occasional question answered.
 
Thanks so much for your help!
 
 
 
MickeyExplorer said:
Hello!  We're building a new house which is almost done, and I want to replace the prewired system (which I did to get the sensor wiring done at build time) with an Elk so I can integrate it with other home automation things.  They wired it up yesterday and here's what I saw:
 
* Above the structured wiring panel, they added a metal enclosure with the Honeywell unit.  
* They combined several sensors per zone (twisting the wires together).  They did label each zone but not each individual wire.
* They added a 2000 ohm resistor right there at the panel for each zone, which according to the sticker on the panel door is what it needs.
 
So here's what i'm thinking after I take possession:
 
* I replace THEIR metal enclosure with the one from the M1 gold kit (my wife would prefer white to their light brown anyway, and I figure the mounting will be easier)
* I get enough M1XIN units to handle each zone individually rather than combining, because that gives me more options when I integrate with other HA stuff.
* The fact they put their resistors at the panel means I can just remove them and tell the ELK not to care about EOL resistors. (Right?)
* I snake cables from the alarm panel down to the structured wiring panel right below it and mount the M1XEP unit in the structured wiring panel.
 
Questions:
* Do my thoughts make sense?  (Am I right about the EOL resistors?)
Yes you can throw out the resistors on the occupied zones, on the Elk they serve no purpose installed in the enclosure.
 
MickeyExplorer said:
* How many M1XIN units can you get in the typical M1 Gold enclosure?  I need to get an exact count but it looks to me like there are about 20 sensor wires so I *should* just need one for now.  Will it fit?
How many adapters depends on what all else you plan to put in the enclosure. I would make a list of all parts and plan their placement from scratch. It's easier to do after you have all of the parts on hand.
 
MickeyExplorer said:
* Is there any reason why or why not to put things in the structured wiring panel vs the alarm enclosure?  Right now we're thinking self monitoring but are there rules or guidelines about that?
This is a tough one. There are code requirements mostly concerning power lines so it depends on compnent placement.
 
MickeyExplorer said:
* If anyone has suggestions on Elk dealers (US, Arizona, if it matters) I'd be happy to take them.  I'm pretty handy with IT stuff so in addition to supplying the units I might just need the occasional question answered.
Automated Outlet in Texas is a sponsor here but any Elk authorized dealer is good. Warranty requires you to buy from an authorized dealer. You may like to use one that is close to you but after the sale support is important and my experience with AO support was excellent.
 
 
MickeyExplorer said:
Thanks so much for your help!
 
Mike.
 
I would remove the old panel and then plan the Elk install from scratch. Elk sells a 24" 14" tall enclosure and a "28" enclosure so you want to know how many components are going in the enclosure before buying.
 
Make a plan and then make a parts list and leave room in the can for growth. Start at the beginning and when you get stuck I'm sure that someone here will be able to set you in the right direction again.
 
Mike.
 
You should be able to fit a single M1XIN in the 14" can.   If you mount the XIN using SWGs, it should fit to the left or right of the M1 board.
 
Take a look at some of the pictures in the Elk M1 Hall of Fame to get an idea of what it might look like.  Most of the pictures are of large installations, but there are a some of the 14" can.
 
If you have the room, using the 28" enclosure will give you room for growth.
 
Thank you, mikefamig and RAL.  They put the Honeywell enclosure (which is small, either 12 or 14", I'll measure it this morning) above the structured wiring panel; I don't think there's 24" or 28" between the structured wiring panel and the ceiling, but I really only need "alarm" bits in the alarm enclosure, and can put everything else in the structured wiring panel below.  Seems like one M1XIN could go left and the battery could go on the right?  Or if push really came to shove I suppose I could mount a 24" or 28" on the wall horizontally - has anyone ever done that? 
 
I wouldn't mount a 28" enclosure horizontally.  Rather, put another 14" enclosure or whatever fits side by side with the existing one.
 
The XIN could also fit to the left or right of the battery, as you suggested.  You could even put it in the structured wiring enclosure if you had to.  Though you'd need to re-route the wires to the sensors there as well.
 
Welcome OP!  Seems like you've done your homework, and have a pretty good grasp of what's going on here.  I'll just add a couple points...
 
Many DIY'ers like to have their I/O cards flat on plates, but the glides to work just fine and take up way less space.  Do you know just how much you plan to expand the M1?  I know a basic M1 is fine in the 14", but the more stuff you add, the more space you need.  I couldn't imagine going with less than a 28" if you're going to get into multiple serial interfaces, input/output boards, etc. 

My previous house was more centralized than this house... in that 28" can I had M1XIN, M1XOVR, M1RB, M1DBH, a bigger battery, 2x M1XSP's (with a 3rd for testing); plus a couple UPB interface plugs into the outlet, and even theElk124 sound recorder/playback module.  It was a very full can. 

Here I went overkill and have the 50" can with another house-original 14" can below - but then I pulled all the structured wiring out of there and relocated to a 12U wall-mount rack right next to it - so the 50" can is only 1/3rd full (I use the 14" can as a subpanel in the garage and have half my expansion cards there).  In hindsight I'm a way bigger believer in keeping security separate and pretty self-contained.  I'll also just add - don't feel like you're stuck with a bad wall configuration...  Drywall is cheap - so if you wanted to rearrange the existing can to move it down and sink another alarm-only can above or next to it, you probably can with minimal fixing.  The Hall of Fame RAL mentioned is a great place for inspiration, even though there are things done in there that I would NEVER recommend - most importantly, the use of cross-connect blocks.
 
I lied when I said that the enclosures are 24" and 28"! They are 14" and 28". I have to stop relying on my memory.
 
Mike.
 
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