X10 and HAI Omni IIe + PSC05 2way

[jeffmowens]

Hi all... hopefully one of you will be able to help me diagnose this problem.

We have an Omni IIe v3.2 firmware successfully installed and operational. Attached is a X10 PRO PSC05 2-way powerline interface that also successfully sends X10 commands to a small handful of property lighting (floods, etc.).

Recently, we were adding an extra X10 flood w/ motion (the kind that has the +1 options to send X10 to turn on other devices when it triggers). The flood operates as expected and tests show its +1 sending is working fine as well as we've witnessed the other devices turning on.

So, if the Omni can send commands to all these X10 devices, including the new motion/flood, with the PSC05 we should also be able to "see" X10 as well and react, correct?

The PSC05' LED blinks when it detects X10 on the line (eg. the new motion's trigger) but the Omni doesn't register any of the X10 on the line....??

We check the unit status via PCAccess -- no updates.
We set a very simple automation trigger (eg. WHEN X-10 B 6, THEN X-10 Unit 13 ON) -- nothing either.

Any thoughts, suggestions?

Thanks for the help! B)

 

[Rupp]

What X10 devices do you have that transmit X10 signals.

 

[pete_c]

The X-10 Floods with motion are known to be problematic. I used them about 10 years or so ago in the old home. Today I have outdoor wired motion sensors hooked up to the OPII and use the motion sensors to turn on the Landscaping lights after certain hours.

I also use an X10 amplifier for the X10 controller hooked up to the OPII.

 

[jeffmowens]

Hey guys. First, thanks for taking the time to help.

To answer your questions, I'm using the Leviton motion/floods model 6417. It's not a problem with them -- they work fine. As I said, they will turn on themselves and any other X10 device addressed w/o failure.

The Omni IIe sends X10 to turn on (any device), and they turn on as expected -- so we know the Omni is sending fine.

The 6417's send fine too because when they get motion, any other device tuned to its +1 values will also turn on -- this includes other X10 floods, appliance modules and/or lamp modules of the same code. In our tests ANY X10 device of the same or +n values activates as expected.

In short, the flood gets a signal correctly, and sends signals correctly w/o issue.

The problem is the Omni doesn't "see" those X10 signals on the line like it's supposed to. Even though the PSC05 blinks when they are present, the Omni doesn't register as seeing them.

Consider this:
1) the Omni sends a B5 ON through the PSC05. The motion floods turn ON.
2) when the B5 motion detects movement, it sends a B5 and B6 ON commands on the line.
3) all B5 and B6 units subsequently turn on (as expected).

In that situation, there is no delay, and no failure -- very reliable behavior.

In fact, if I plug a lamp module into the same outlet that the PSC05 was plugged into (inside the cabinet w/ the Omni), it will turn on when it receives a B6 ON command.

So we know:
> the outlet is on the same phase and not dirty;
> the PCS05 blinks (by deisng) when X10 signals are present;
> AND a lamp module works as expected when plugged into the same outlet.

Souldn't the Omni (via the same outlet and PSC05) see those X10 signals on the line too?

In what situation would the Omni be able to use the PSC05 to send signals, but not receive them (given that it blinks when they are present). Is it possible it can on send, yet blink, but still not pass them on to the Omni?

Very confused by this... B)

Thanks again!

 

[BLH]

The PSC05 has a common; transmit; receive and zero crossing signal pin.

In theory the received signal may not be passing back to the Omni even if the PSC05s LED is blinking with a received X10 signal or the Omni for some reason is no processing the message.

Is there any jumper in the Omni to pick a one way or two way X10 Interface. The signals are slightly different with the one way versus the two way.

 

[pete_c]

I've never run any OPII events based on received X10 events. I have an external to OPII panel controller connected to the HA server.

Did a little experiment. I have multiple controllers on line. Put the following in:

30. WHEN X-10 A-1 ON
THEN LOG X10 Received
THEN All Consoles BEEP 3

Sent an "A1" via external controller. OPII receives A1, logs entry, changes status and beeps console 3 times. (using PCA)

I can then send an X10 command via HA controller and it should log the A1 command received.

 

[jeffmowens]

Ok great.

So Pete, your tests conclude that I either have a faulty Omni IIe or PSC05, would you agree?

I'm going to assume that your test case was using the OIIe + PSC05. Just don't want to make a decision on a bad board w/o verifying the PSC05 is potentially incompatible...?

Thanks agian.

Any other thoughts on tests I should perform to try to debug further?

 

[JeffVolp]

So Pete, your tests conclude that I either have a faulty Omni IIe or PSC05, would you agree?

Any other thoughts on tests I should perform to try to debug further?

Have you verified the cable between your Omni IIe and the PSC05 doesn't have a broken wire?

Jeff

 

[pete_c]

I'm going to assume that your test case was using the OIIe + PSC05.

Yes plus Jeff's XTB amplifier.

So Pete, your tests conclude that I either have a faulty Omni IIe or PSC05, would you agree?

Yes but do one more test.

Any other thoughts on tests I should perform to try to debug further?

You can connect your PSC05 to a PC using a generic DB9 serial cable and use a freeware X10 application to validate its function.


I also have Jeff's X10 Amp in place between the X10 HAI controller and the 120VAC outlet. I've had it in place for about 5 years. Works great.

My primary control for all my Insteon switches is via X10 / HAI OPII panel (last 5 years). I do also now have a UBP PIM and Z-Wave PIM connected to OPII (along with UPB and Z-Wave switches).

 

[jeffmowens]

I'm back from vacation and wanted to follow-up on this thread ... thanks for the past responses helping me to debug this problem.

To summarize, I have an Omni IIe (which has only one serial port). I chose to run X10 on it because I have used those common X10 outdoor floodlights for years with success.

Recently, I upgraded the Omni firmware and added some automation to control those floods -- works great on send.

However, when the +1 features of those is fired, the PSC05/Omni act as thought nothing was sent on the line.

To test reception, I've plugged in a lamp module into the same outlet as the PSC05, addressed to the +1 address. The lamp module turns on instantly when it sees the +1 sent from the floods.

When X10 is sent on the wire, I do see the PSC05 LED blink -- but still no recognition by the Omini.

I switched out the phone cord between the PSC05 and Omni and still nothing. I've also double-checked the status indicator and unit addressing in Dealer PC Access.

So... at this point I was going to get some sort of X10 send/receive testing tool or whatever to further diagnose and continue along this path, but I'm wondering if I should scrap the X10 route and go UPB.

The only catch with UPB is being able to send X10 to my existing floods.

Any other thoughts?

 

[pete_c]

I have an OPII. I would still test your PSC05 with a serial connection to a PC and freeware X-10 application.

You can also purchase an X10 tester to validate signals in your home.

You have a number of options available. (including the UPB to X10)

 

[jeffmowens]

I have an OPII. I would still test your PSC05 with a serial connection to a PC and freeware X-10 application.

You can also purchase an X10 tester to validate signals in your home.

You have a number of options available. (including the UPB to X10)

Thanks. Regarding the UPB to X10 -- I can't find that device anywhere (only X10 -> UPB bridge). I deally I would like to interface the Omni to UPB direct and translate X10 out of that device for the X10 floods -- and convert everything else to UPB. Since I only have one serial on the Omni IIe, how can I accomplish talking to both UPB and X10 devices?

 

[pete_c]

Found this but no longer sold.

UPB to X10

You can also just get an HAI UPB PIM and utilize this on your powerline to convert any powerline X10 to UPB.

X-10 to UPB

Not sure but you can maybe also utilize this UPB to X10 Bridge to go back to X10.

UPB to X10 bridge

I wouldn't bother with any of the above and go with UPB and convert your X10 motion sensor floodlights to UPB.

The topic of replacing an outdoor X10 motion sensor / floodlight has been discussed here:

Replacing an X-10 with UPB