Yet another new user/installation

[Lensman]

Greetings Cocooners. This is my first post so be gentle

I wired my new home well for network and video (2 each cat5e, cat6, rg6 to each room) but not as well as I should have for HA. More wiring isn't the issue, I'll find a way to get wires where I need them (drop ceiling on the first floor and conduit to the attic so wiring is easy). Everything is home-run to a dedicated equipment room on the first floor (this house is at the Jersey shore so no basement).

I plan to use Z-Wave for all my lighting control (and whatever else I can - still researching this).

Based on what I've seen in the forums here, I'm leaning toward the Elk M1 Gold controller and the Z-Wave integration for it (don't remember the model at the moment).

I have not selected the control software as yet. I have done very little research into this. I did download and play with Premise which looks good but I would prefer something I could extend with custom code (I'm a .NET developer in real life). My plans include location-sensitive voice control in the future. I'm interested in discussing ideas around that with anyone who may have some insights.

The biggest unknown for me is the security system. The house has a Brinks panel and three keypads (doors, windows, smokes, heat, glass-break). I want to integrate the security system but the Brinks panel seems to be an issue. I have no problem swapping the panel and keypads if needed but would like to be able to re-use the contact and keypad wires if possible. Suggestions on what to use in its place are welcome. Can the Elk do this?

For the first phase, I plan to do some lighting control based on garage doors opening, use of Harmony remote to watch TV/Movie, time of day for outside lighting and things like that. I want to include control of the security system in this phase as well, if possible. I eventually plan to extend the system to include whole-house, multi-zone audio, security cams, voice recognition and response, personalized calendars, wake-ups and more.

I'm reading through the how-tos which are great. I've wanted to do this for years and decided this house is the place to begin.

Ideas and suggestions (especially for the security system) are welcome. Thanks in advance.

 

[Steve]

Welcome to CocoonTech!

Yes, you are not the first to ask this question In fact if you search around I'm sure you'll find find long threads with great info. But in a nutshell, should be easy to swap out Brinks panel with Elk or HAI. All standard Normally Closed (or Open) contact will work find. There are 2 main things that you need to look for. 1. Are there End Of Line (EOL) resistors at the contacts? If there are you need to make sure they are compatible with the panel you get. Chances are however there are not as most installers tend to put the resistors in the panel. LOTS of info on this all around CT. The second thing is any proprietary wireless stuff will most likely not work. But is should be pretty easy and many have done this. Keypads will work off of 2 pair or Cat5.

You can search around on voice control, its not discussed here too much because it mostly does not work well with open air mic's in a typical family household with many people and background noises. But look around as its been discussed some.

With ZWave and Elk, DON'T use the Elk Zwave module, use and M1XSP and and RZCop, even Elk will tell you this.

As far as software, I would focus on your hardware/security/automation panel and lighting first, then you can eval different software to supplement it.

 

[FrankMc]

Hi

As Steve mentions the EOL resistors would most likely have to be swapped out and if located in the field (where they should be) could be a bugger to get to......
On another thread regarding EOL resistors i mentioned an Australian panel which allows you to select each zone EOL so no need to replace current resistors...

http://www.genesiselectronics.com.au/securadvantages.php

I have an early version of this panel which i use to use to control my lighting (on/off) until i decided to install Clipal CBUS Dimmers...It has a scripting engine which is very very good..

http://www.genesiselectronics.com.au/script.php

As for software if you wish to do some of your own plugins maybe have a look at xPL....Theres been a lot of chat recently regarding the security schema ....

http://www.xplmonkey.com/xpl.html

http://wiki.xplproject.org.uk/index.php/XPL_News

As steve stated its highly unlikely you will be able to keep your wireless keypads if you source a different panel........
HTH
Frank

 

[Lensman]

Will do more searching around here. I don't think there are any EOL resistors but will double check the panel and pull one door contact (easiest to get to) to be sure. Would there be EOL resistors on the smoke detectors as well?

No wireless anything in this system so shouldn't be a problem.

Sounds like the Elk is the right choice so I'll look into using it for security and HA. I read in another thread that a couple of central monitoring companies work with the Elk in some fashion so that is also good.

Thanks for the help so far.

 

[Monk]

Will do more searching around here. I don't think there are any EOL resistors but will double check the panel and pull one door contact (easiest to get to) to be sure. Would there be EOL resistors on the smoke detectors as well?

Can't speak to the smokes, but you should be able to measure the resistance of door / window zones at the panel area using an ohm meter. (disconnect the zone wires from panel first)

 

[Rupp]

HomeSeer is one of the most extendable packages and it's SDK is written in .net so that should be right up you ally.

 

[gfs]

Agree. HomeSeer offers you the most flexibility and the greatest opportunity to grow.

 

[felixrosbergen]

Somebody should really make a panel whith a bunch of relays that you hook the field wiring (with whatever EOL resistor value) into and then have a 2nd set of wires go to your alarm panel. You may loose EOL functionality but at least you can get a functional system without opening the walls.

 

[WSeverino]

Several options for the control portion:

1) Homeseer - as everyone said, very good product.
2) mControl
3) Vera from Micasaverde

I went with option 3, for the simple fact you don't have to have a PC up and running the whole time. Vera is an Asus wireless router that Micasaverde puts their Linux based software on. These guys are good with adding feature requests, and they are even adding support for the Schlage link lock.

 

[jlehnert]

Would there be EOL resistors on the smoke detectors as well?

If the smokes are integrated with the brinks panel, then the answer is probably yes. If you have a standalone 120V system, then no.

 

[Lensman]

Thanks for all the replies. This helps a great deal.

The smokes are wired into the panel (as are keypads) so I'm optimistic on their re-use.

One poster suggested the EOLs belong in the field rather than at the panel. Curious as to why you feel that way. Having them at the panel makes install and maintenance so much easier. Does it really make that much of a difference?

Homeseer is where I will start looking for software.

Now to scrape together some funds for the Elk and Z-Wave devices.

Anyone have experience dealing with either zwaveproducts.com or orchestratedhome.com??

 

[fcwilt]

EOL resistors installed at the panel serve no purpose. They are intended to detect tampering with the connections to the sensors. If you are not going to install them where they serve a purpose you might just as well leave them off and set the M1 accordingly.

 

[Lensman]

I emailed Elk about the Z-Wave integration and they told me there are no plans to enhance the Z-Wave module. I asked if it was end-of-life and if so what were they looking at supporting going forward. No answer to date.

Anyone here know? Are they leaning toward ZigBee? Is ZigBee even viable in the home yet? There doesn't seem to be a large selection of ZigBee components yet.

Still leaning toward Elk and Homeseer but since I haven't purchased anything for lighting control yet am still somewhat flexible there (although it must be wireless).

 

[Spanky]

Elk's M1 support for Zwave is through the Leviton RZCOP Zwave interface module and the M1XSP serial port expander. Leviton keeps the Zwave module updated with the latest hardware and software changes.

In addition to Zwave for wireless lighting control there is Radio RA, and the Centralite JetStream which is a Zigbee wireless solution.

 

[Neurorad]

Don't buy lighting, alarm, HomeSeer (or other controller) all at once.

One step at a time.

It might take a while for each step, and you can spend the time learning about the next step. Also, new equipment coming along the pike regularly. Might take a couple/few months to get the alarm panel up and running. Many suggest setting up the alarm on the bench first, to get a good feel for it.

I'm in the same boat as you, still getting my feet wet.

Edit - proverbially, of course. By getting my feet wet, I don't mean the boat is sinking.

You live in NJ, or NYC? I grew up in CT myself, NYC 'burbs.