Hey you. Tell me how you would build your house. Why am I wrong?

[picta]

The Omnitouch 5.7(e) is no longer being sold and the Omnitouch 7 doesn't have intercom. So this won't work because I can't even buy one with the functionality. So HOW do you do intercom with an Omnipro?
 
-James

You may still be able to find 5.7e at resellers, and it is also possible that HAI will upgrade OT7 by the time you finish construction. If you pre-wire with 2 cat5 for each intercom location, this will cover majority of systems.
 
Another alternative is to get a Russound for the whole house audio and their ComPoint Intercom, and use a mix of keypads (audio/intercom and even mini-speaker) at each location. I would then add a few iPads running Haiku to locations like master bedroom and living room to interact with HAI panel and show video from connected cameras. Not totally "out-of-the-box" solution, but gives you a wide set of functions.
 
http://www.russound.com/compoint_overview.php

 

[wkearney99]

You've got a couple of 'Holy Grail' levels of integration involved here.
 
For one, local integration with whole home audio is tricky, at best.  The trouble is amp location, that and bluetooth range.  To provide anything more than just background level music (which is actually more that sufficient for most sitiations) you need to have more amplification than will fit inside of a wall switch box.  So you then have to plan around pulling wires to some place this amp can be placed.  This almost never works in a residential situation.  Instead it's usually better to have a centralized location and possible a multi-channel amplifier (a la Russound).  
 
But then you run afoul of the Bluetooth range problem.  A central location typically isn't going to be close enough to allow for portable devices to speak to it.  Bit of shame none of the WHA folks have made a Bluetooth receiver for their keypads.  But then you'd still have the problem of saturating the 2.4gHz frequencies with too much traffic, leading to drop-outs and generally poor performance.
 
Thus using something like the Sonos Connect (without the amp) fed into a WHA setup is a typical setup.  That way you're not using bluetooth, nor are you limited to just the media on the device.  That and you have multiple ways to control the source zone.
 
Do not forget, centralization may be a very important factor for parental control.  As in, it's dinner time, turn off the music and come down... now....  Ok, let me use the remote from here to turn it off for you...  
 
As for intercoms, meh, I've never seen them used effectively.  They seem like a good idea, but of the many folks I know that have them, next to nobody uses them. Nothing seems to work as well as Dad having to bellow "Listen to your mother... NOW!" from across the house.  If anything, cordless phones with intercom features seem more useful.  
 
WRT conduits, sometimes it's best to install both regular in-wall wire with EMPTY conduits.  That way if there's more you need to add you don't have to disturb anything already in place.  

 

[Neurorad]

Many pros use a phone system for the paging function.  I think NEC and Panasonic offer this, but you'll have to research; the pro-installed systems have a steep learning curve, IMO.  This solution removes the intercom from the rest of the system, both physically and electronically - no need to worry about positioning of in-wall keypads.  Some whole-house, distributed audio systems provide a paging input to the audio system, to allow muting of audio during paging.  I don't know how or if the pro phone systems offer this page/mute capability, but I think they do.  Intercoms have a shelf life of about 10-15 years, IMO, so you won't need to deal with in-wall intercom keypad clutter when you replace the phone paging intercom system.
 
I would think Legrand and Leviton are poised to release integrated intercoms and audio systems that could be controlled with phones and tablets, but it still may be a couple years off.  That's the direction I see their audio and intercom systems headed.
 
Both OnQ LyriQ and Russound Compoint intercoms are Decora-style, so they fit in nicely with existing switches, physically; electrical integration isn't really required for the intercom, to a great extent.
 
If I was building now, I'd use Russound C-Series for audio, Russound Compoint for intercom, and Elk M1 or HAI OPII for security.  The M1 and OPII would allow for integration of lighting control, and access control.  However, I'm unsure how well the Russound Compoint works with a front door camera station; you'd need to research that, if you really want that. 

 

[Neurorad]

Speaking of Bluetooth, I see Russound offers a local Bluetooth Source Kit, the BSK1.
 
 

The BSK-1 Bluetooth® Source Kit enables a portable media player, smartphone, or other device equipped with Bluetooth® wireless technology to transmit audio content to any multiroom audio system.
The BSK-1 kit can be used as a global source for system-wide access, or as a Local Source for independent use by a specific room when used with a C-Series system. Local source use with C-Series controllers provides additional automation features automatically turning on the audio, selecting the BSK-1 source input and setting the volume in a room configured as the 'Primary Zone' via SCS-C5 software.
The BTC-1x Remote Transceiver is wired with a single CAT-5 cable up to 300' allowing for optimum placement in different system environments. It also features a class 2 transciever with a 49' (15m) range and the Advanced Audio Distribution Profile (A2DP) ensures high quality stereo audio.
The BTC-1 serves as a streamlined termination point for power, audio and 12VDC trigger connections to the host audio system.

Standard Features

• Add Bluetooth audio streaming to a multiroom audio installation
• Remote transceiver for optimum range placement
• Free custom naming software for easy identification

http://www.russound.com/product_detail.php?i=3280

 

[milnejames]

Many pros use a phone system for the paging function.  I think NEC and Panasonic offer this, but you'll have to research; the pro-installed systems have a steep learning curve, IMO.  This solution removes the intercom from the rest of the system, both physically and electronically - no need to worry about positioning of in-wall keypads.  Some whole-house, distributed audio systems provide a paging input to the audio system, to allow muting of audio during paging.  I don't know how or if the pro phone systems offer this page/mute capability, but I think they do.  Intercoms have a shelf life of about 10-15 years, IMO, so you won't need to deal with in-wall intercom keypad clutter when you replace the phone paging intercom system.
 
I would think Legrand and Leviton are poised to release integrated intercoms and audio systems that could be controlled with phones and tablets, but it still may be a couple years off.  That's the direction I see their audio and intercom systems headed.
 
Both OnQ LyriQ and Russound Compoint intercoms are Decora-style, so they fit in nicely with existing switches, physically; electrical integration isn't really required for the intercom, to a great extent.
 
If I was building now, I'd use Russound C-Series for audio, Russound Compoint for intercom, and Elk M1 or HAI OPII for security.  The M1 and OPII would allow for integration of lighting control, and access control.  However, I'm unsure how well the Russound Compoint works with a front door camera station; you'd need to research that, if you really want that. 

This is great advice. Thank you. I think I've decided on the Omni HOWEVER, I hear the Omnipro 3 is coming shortly (although they wont confirm it yet). Hopefully by the time I pull the trigger it will be out. Now to just decide on lyriq vs russound. Are either one technically 'compatible' with the HAI solution? AKA, can the OP2 send alerts over the intercom, or take commands that way?
 
Also on the Bluetooth side, honestly I guess I can get one of these (not this specific one, because it looks like crap, but just used for example).
 
http://www.amazon.com/VicTsing-Portable-Bluetooth-Streaming-Receiver/dp/B00GX71GNO/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1403276172&sr=8-4&keywords=bluetooth+to+3.5mm
 
That way I can have my distributed sources but don't have the bluetooth problem. I can get a SONOS: Connect or whatever for the wife, and let the kids use these little ones for their rooms. 
 
Hmmm. So much to think about. 

 

[wkearney99]

Speaking of Bluetooth, I see Russound offers a local Bluetooth Source Kit, the BSK1.
http://www.russound.com/product_detail.php?i=3280

 
Ah, right, forgot about that one.  I've got CAV66 gear, not the latest C-series.  Anyone tried the BSK interface?
 
I'd still recommend the sonos solution.  The client software and it's all-around usability is really hard to beat.  It's pretty much set-and-forget setup-wise.  Either as a source fed via line-level into your WHA solution, or as standalone players with their own speakers inside.  Not cheap, but definitely worth it for the headache-reduction it's ease of use brings to the game.  
 
I know how to integrate all kinds of nonsense, but I've learned not to torment my wife with the gizmos.

 

[wkearney99]

That way I can have my distributed sources but don't have the bluetooth problem. I can get a SONOS: Connect or whatever for the wife, and let the kids use these little ones for their rooms. 

 
Sonos makes a bridge dock for iOS devices.  Plug it into the dock and it becomes a source for any Sonos players on the network.  Handy, but it does require it being in the dock, which makes control a bit of a hassle (vs using it handheld).  I suppose it comes down what sources are used to obtain music.  If you use a lot of streaming sources the Sonos handles them great.  Which is also a fine way to avoid a lot of unexpected purchases from iTunes (not to mention depriving those assh*les at Apple the revenue, but that's a whole other rant).
 
Using the standalone gizmos might be less expensive but you also lose out on network access.  As in, Mom said come to dinner... remote: off goes the zone.
 
I kid you not, the money spent on the Sonos gear is worth it.  Scour eBay for refurb units if you want to save a bit.  I picked up a Connect:Amp that way and it's been working great.

 

[tmbrown97]

If you want iOS to integrate with your sonos, skip the dock and use an Airport Express hooked into the line in of the sonos.  Then your phone is the remote and it stays with you.
 
I had my first chance to play with Sonos last week on a job - and it was a nice system, no doubt (using connect amps) but it's so hard for me to justify spending that much money on each zone when a Russound would cost a fraction of that.  However, the pain saved in simplicity of wiring may help offset that a bit.

 

[Frunple]

IOS and Android are already integrated into Sonos. No need to add anything. Just use the "this device" option from the music menu in Sonos.

 

[picta]

Russound is naitvely supported by HAI, lyriq is not. HAI can make announcements via most systems with paging support.
 

This is great advice. Thank you. I think I've decided on the Omni HOWEVER, I hear the Omnipro 3 is coming shortly (although they wont confirm it yet). Hopefully by the time I pull the trigger it will be out. Now to just decide on lyriq vs russound. Are either one technically 'compatible' with the HAI solution? AKA, can the OP2 send alerts over the intercom, or take commands that way?

 

[signal15]

The Vera still seems more hobbyist to me whereas a Elk M1 Gold or HAI OmniPro II are more "pro" solutions.  The HAI can be a complete kit with audio, intercom, lighting, HVAC, Security - all in a single system that works together out of the box.  It's a little pricey but that's because you're buying everything up front - you can spend years expanding on it without really incurring more costs.  That's contrary to the instincts of the common hobbyist but I'd bet many of us started small then once we figured things out, wouldn't hesitate to do that on our second run at automation.
 
If I were in your shoes today, I think I'd do the HAI OmniPro II just because they can run the entire ecosystem with plug & play touchscreens that control everything without much custom programming work.
 
I'm with picta - I've looked at that system a few times in desperate search for a simple wall-mount touchscreen with intercom and audio - but since I can't tie in my other systems, it quickly falls off the list.  I wish it were more open to 3rd party driver development - then it'd probably actually have a place in the automation market.

 
 
And this is the mistake everyone makes about the Vera....  It's marketed and sold as a Z-wave solution...  but it's SO much more than that.  I only have a few Z-wave locks on mine, but I've got 48 lighting loads through a LiteTouch system on it, and FULL integration with my Elk M1.  I moved all of my HA logic to the Vera, it's the brains of the system and it's WAY more flexible than the Elk's HA logic.  There are plugins for Russound, Somfy blinds, and a ton of other things.  As for being consumer grade, maybe the packaging is (it's a little green plastic box).  But it's powerful, and you have FULL control over what it does unlike most other solutions.  If it doesn't do something, you can make it do it with a little LUA programming.  I've got voice alerts using the Vera Alerts plugin and an old Android phone, I have it chirping the siren and speaking instructions on what to do if a water sensor trips, speaking the weather when I disarm the Elk in the morning, etc.  I've got it disarming the alarm on a valid code entry on the Yale lock on the front door, and turning off lights when motion hasn't been sensed for a period of time.  Functionality-wise, it's FAR from consumer/hobbyist grade equipment.
 
I was playing around at my last house with a bunch of different technologies, and when I moved out I had an Elk M1 Gold, a Vera, and a bunch of crappy Z-wave switches.  In my new house, I thought long and hard about what I wanted to do and I put in another Elk and another Vera because they worked so nicely in conjunction with each other.  I would highly recommend this solution.  The Vera Lite is like $169 on Amazon, if it doesn't work out for you, then you're not exactly breaking the bank.  It certainly has its quirks, just like everything.  But, it's stable, and it does what it's supposed to very well.
 
My next endeavor is to buy the 28" 4k Lenovo ThinkVision that runs Kit Kat, and turn it into a badass central management screen for all of my HA stuff using Tasker and an app that is still in Beta that provides a bridge between Vera and Tasker.  This allows me to create widgets for controlling all of my HA stuff.  This way, I don't have to rely on the look/feel of some HA app that may or may not support everything I want (surveillance cams, etc).  
 
BTW, I tried using the Elk only for HA.  I wouldn't say it sucked, but it was VERY limited in what it integrated with.  And, the programming logic was kinda crappy and had limited storage.  You'll run into this with HAI also, which is why most HA people get a 3rd party HA controller that integrates.  Keep in mind that there is not currently a plugin for HAI for the Vera, so if you want to integrate it with a security system, you'll need to go with an Elk, GE, Ademco, or one of the other ones that has a plugin.  I was going to go with something other than an Elk, but I like the relays on the Elk (which I can control with the Vera), and the fact that I can still do some crazy things with the automation logic on the Elk to give the Vera more capability (like using a phantom output to allow the Vera to control/view chime status and make decisions on certain voice alerts based on that).  You can view the plugins available at http://apps.mios.com

 

[Neurorad]

Take a look at the new Russound X5.
http://www.electronichouse.com/product/details/xstream_x5/

It looks like a Sonos competitor, but also offers keypads, which I really like. I don't carry my phone around at home, typically, and keypads are faster and easier anyway. It won't be plug and play with HAI, as are the older Russound systems (currently, anyway).

 

[Neurorad]

The Russound C-Series (C5 > C3), though, combined with the Russound DMS-3.1 streamer, still looks like a very good option for new construction.

I don't see a paging option input for the Russound X-Stream, with a quick search. Not a deal breaker for most people, but might be for you.

 

[Neurorad]

Keep in mind that audio keypads and in-wall touchscreens are ideally at eye height, like thermostats. I would think that in-wall intercoms would be best at this level as well.

The 2-gang Russound C-Series and X-stream KPs are not Decora style, and may be a slight challenge to install next to Russound Compound intercoms. I think I read that Russound used to offer a combined wall plate for them, but not sure.

IIRC, Russound C5 can be expanded up to 36 zones.

 

[milnejames]

And this is the mistake everyone makes about the Vera....  It's marketed and sold as a Z-wave solution...  but it's SO much more than that.  I only have a few Z-wave locks on mine, but I've got 48 lighting loads through a LiteTouch system on it, and FULL integration with my Elk M1.  I moved all of my HA logic to the Vera, it's the brains of the system and it's WAY more flexible than the Elk's HA logic.  There are plugins for Russound, Somfy blinds, and a ton of other things.  As for being consumer grade, maybe the packaging is (it's a little green plastic box).  But it's powerful, and you have FULL control over what it does unlike most other solutions.  If it doesn't do something, you can make it do it with a little LUA programming.  I've got voice alerts using the Vera Alerts plugin and an old Android phone, I have it chirping the siren and speaking instructions on what to do if a water sensor trips, speaking the weather when I disarm the Elk in the morning, etc.  I've got it disarming the alarm on a valid code entry on the Yale lock on the front door, and turning off lights when motion hasn't been sensed for a period of time.  Functionality-wise, it's FAR from consumer/hobbyist grade equipment.
 
I was playing around at my last house with a bunch of different technologies, and when I moved out I had an Elk M1 Gold, a Vera, and a bunch of crappy Z-wave switches.  In my new house, I thought long and hard about what I wanted to do and I put in another Elk and another Vera because they worked so nicely in conjunction with each other.  I would highly recommend this solution.  The Vera Lite is like $169 on Amazon, if it doesn't work out for you, then you're not exactly breaking the bank.  It certainly has its quirks, just like everything.  But, it's stable, and it does what it's supposed to very well.
 
My next endeavor is to buy the 28" 4k Lenovo ThinkVision that runs Kit Kat, and turn it into a badass central management screen for all of my HA stuff using Tasker and an app that is still in Beta that provides a bridge between Vera and Tasker.  This allows me to create widgets for controlling all of my HA stuff.  This way, I don't have to rely on the look/feel of some HA app that may or may not support everything I want (surveillance cams, etc).  
 
BTW, I tried using the Elk only for HA.  I wouldn't say it sucked, but it was VERY limited in what it integrated with.  And, the programming logic was kinda crappy and had limited storage.  You'll run into this with HAI also, which is why most HA people get a 3rd party HA controller that integrates.  Keep in mind that there is not currently a plugin for HAI for the Vera, so if you want to integrate it with a security system, you'll need to go with an Elk, GE, Ademco, or one of the other ones that has a plugin.  I was going to go with something other than an Elk, but I like the relays on the Elk (which I can control with the Vera), and the fact that I can still do some crazy things with the automation logic on the Elk to give the Vera more capability (like using a phantom output to allow the Vera to control/view chime status and make decisions on certain voice alerts based on that).  You can view the plugins available at http://apps.mios.com

The problem is the WAF factor. I'm an engineer, my wife is a nurse who couldn't care less about how 'cool' it is, as long as it works. 
 
I thought I was hard set on the omni, but now I hear another one is coming out that is fully IP centric. So crap. I have ~4-5 months before the house is done and I will pre-wire the world as needed, but damn. What if it isn't out by when I want it. I get where the Vera is a hobbiest product on these boards, but if I put in 50-100 devices then range shouldn't be an issue. As always the only issue I can't figure out is the damn intercom. Everything works great with WHA but the supposed 'intercom' that the Omni integrates with is on the old ass keypads that are end of sale and the new ones have nothing similar. Pfffft. My brain hurts.