How do you control low voltage lighting with the M1?

nexus

New Member
I’m looking to get some input on the best way to control low voltage lighting with the M1. I currently have a low voltage landscape transformer installed in the garage with the following specs:
Output 11-13V 900VA w/three circuits. So it will handle a maximum lamp load of 300 watts per circuit.

My M1 is located in the basement and I have an ELK-M1XOVR that still needs to be mounted. Does anyone have any diagrams for wiring this type of setup that they could post? Should I mount the M1XOVR by the transformer in the garage or with the M1? It’s been a while since I've messed with relays so a refresher would be helpful. Is the XOVR the right product for this application?

Thanks.
 
Unless you need to control the LV branches separately, why not just control the HV supply to the xformer - that's what I do.
 
Unless you need to control the LV branches separately, why not just control the HV supply to the xformer - that's what I do.

I'm trying to avoid integrating another control technology (upb, z-wave, etc.). I currently have RadioRA and I don't believe they have anything that controls an HV outlet.
 
Unless you need to control the LV branches separately, why not just control the HV supply to the xformer - that's what I do.

I'm trying to avoid integrating another control technology (upb, z-wave, etc.). I currently have RadioRA and I don't believe they have anything that controls an HV outlet.

The ELK-M1XOVR will work fine and can be at the panel or anywhere on the 4 wire buss. You an run one side of the low voltage wiring through a relay and write a rule when you want it to activate etc.

Run one side of the low voltage wiring through the common and N/O contacts so when you activate the relay it will turn on the lights.
 
Just watch your total amperage when running through those relays on the low voltage side as I believe they are rated for seven amps or so... :)
 
OK, so if my calculation is correct 300watts/12volts=25amps. So if a branch is maxed out, this could be an issue for the XOVR.

So would I be better off with a 1000Watt dimmer wired inline on the HV side?
 
If I were to do this personally, I would probably mount the OVR at or close to the M1. I would then run an 18-4 from the M1 to a small relay enclosure at the lighting transformer. I would use the ELk relay(s) to trip a larger relay(s) at the lighting transformer relay enclosure that can handle the maximum load. I would use 12vdc from the elk to trigger the coils of the lighting relays. Use the Black wire as the common negative from the elk supply and the other 3 conductors as +12v signal wires for each LV lighting relay(s). That way you can switch the LV circuits however you want. You could even use a generic automotive relay to switch the 12vac of the LV lighting circuit. (The ones with terminals labeled 85, 86, 87, 87a, and 30) They are usually rated for 30A at 12v.
 
Yea, I suspect now that AO launched their new site all links here will be broken now. Here is the link on their new site.
 
I like a combination of Digger and Gatchel's recommendations... Personally, I had a lot of outputs that seemed relevant to the garage - so I mounted my M1XOVR and M1RB in the garage in the can that came with the package I started with. I bought another 28" recessed can for the M1.

So - My setup with the 16 outputs in the garage... 10 sprinkler zones; 1 pool filler; 1 strobe output; leaving 4. I planned (haven't done it yet) to automate my LV lighting by using an automotive relay (they handle a lot of amps) to switch the power on/off to the actual lights. basically the output joins 12V to the relay which is very low amperage, and the automotive relay connects the LV lights to their transformer, turning the lights on. Was going to do this with 2 sets of lights - front and rear. Actually, I have some extras of the elk relays so I figured I'd try them first since they're smaller.

I'd have to use a killawatt though to see what the transformer draws while the load is disconnected... having the transformer on all the time would likely waste some power... if that were the case, since I'm prepped for UPB (too lazy to replace the switches, even though I have everything to do it) - I might move to a UPB controller to switch power to the entire transformer if the current draw warranted it.

All theory - no solid help, but my thought process so far - for what it's worth.
 
I really don't like switching 120 VAC via relays and also having to run that high voltage inside a control box (i.e. where the Elk is installed). It just makes working on that box more complicated because you have to then watch touching any of the high voltage terminals.

If you do want to switch high voltage via a relay, I would mount a relay in its own small box near the outlet, and then run the 12 volt control wiring to the Elk. This could get messy when trying to comply with code as you would have to cut off an extension cord, plug the male end into an outlet, run the cut end into a box with the relay, mount the box on a wall, cut the cord to the lighting transformer and run that cut end into the newly mounted box. It's my understanding (though I am FAR from a code expert) that you can't permanently "mount" anything that is plugged into an outlet via a flexible cord. Also, you get into that low voltage and high voltage wiring mounted inside the same box issue. Again, it's my understanding that the wire type should be rated for the highest voltage inside the box.

These reasons are why I just mounted an X-10 (yes I still use that technology) outlet in an outdoor rated enclosure, and then just plugged my outdoor lighting's transformer in that. Pictures are available in THIS How-To. This method complies with code as it has a rain-tight enclosure and is GFCI protected.

If you want to switch the low voltage side you can indeed use relays as was mentioned above. You would need to use (again mentioned above) the Elk type relays to trip an automotive type relay since the Elk relays can't handle the amperage required.

Since you have an XOVR you can simply use the relays on it to drive automotive relays. You can't use the eight voltage outputs directly as they will only provide 50 milliamps of current (not enough to trip an automotive relay).

You may want to consider a relay of THIS type with it's corresponding SOCKET. It's cheap and can handle 30 amps. Note that the coil resistance is 88 ohms so it will only draw 12 volts/88 ohms = 0.14 amps or 140 milliamps off of your 12 volt source. You can easily mount that relay on a wall or board also.

You would then connect the Elk Relay's "C" to the + 12 volt source, the "NO" to the + coil input of the automotive relay, and the - coil input of the automotive relay to the - 12 volt source. Just be aware of your total 12 volt draw on your overall system. If you are switching a large group of relays (with several on at once) and if your XOVR is a large distance away from your M1, you may want to consider using a 12 volt wall wart as the source plugged near the relays. I would also consider placing an in-line fuse if using the Elk's main 12 volt source so you will not bring down the entire system in case of a problem with these relays.

The "NO" and "C" of the automotive relay would then just switch your + leg of the low voltage transformer’s output.

You could create several switched legs by using multiple relays and separately switch your back yard from your front yard if you wish.

Just some more ideas to kick around! Good luck and let us know if additional details are needed. :huh:
 
I definitely meant switching the LV side, not the HV side... HV in the box isn't something I'd want to work around either... and the relay's BSR mentioned are exactly what I use too... I have one or two connected to my system right now cuz of the tricky garage door wiring - and I always have a few of them laying around.
 
I really don't like switching 120 VAC via relays and also having to run that high voltage inside a control box (i.e. where the Elk is installed). It just makes working on that box more complicated because you have to then watch touching any of the high voltage terminals.
I agree with exposed hi voltage terminals strips. That is why I keep preaching about RIBs - Relay-in-a-box. Very versatile, affordable (~$10 for RIBU1C), easy & safe to wire, multiple voltage inputs, easy to mount, built in LED.
http://hvac.functionaldevices.com/chartPilot.html
 
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