More INSTEON quality control issues!

[Digger]

Keep in mind that I didn't 'force' anyone to edit their posts, nor did I edit anyone's posts myself. By posting that request, and honoring it, we put the ball in their court, which was my only intention.

Agreed and everyone supported you as best they could. SH has shown their true colors. If they really intended to help people and provide the great customer service they claim to have they would have made a presence here. Had they done that they would have been able to say that all of the negativity was untrue. What they have done is prove a lot (not saying this proves everything) of what people are saying.

As a note...Smarthome does not have a presence on their own board, so it does not have anything to do with Cocoontech personally. The offer still stands for anyone who has a problem with their INSTEON installation that I might be able to help to contact me directly, you are welcome to share your experience with others. With the time I have I can be alot more effective with a phone call than going back and forth in a post for a couple of days. Some days I will have the time but other days it is alot harder. I would encourage anyone that I have spoken with to share any part of it that may be benificial to others on the board.

SteveL

I believe that someone at SH told Dan they would have a presence here if the "negativity was removed. It was removed.... so.... where are they?

I am sure people appreciate your volunteering to help but SH should have kept their commitment to Dan or not made it at all.

 

[xlurkr]

The offer still stands for anyone who has a problem with their INSTEON installation that I might be able to help to contact me directly, you are welcome to share your experience with others. With the time I have I can be alot more effective with a phone call than going back and forth in a post for a couple of days. Some days I will have the time but other days it is alot harder. I would encourage anyone that I have spoken with to share any part of it that may be benificial to others on the board.

SteveL

OK, here's one. Where are the user customization tools for the SmartLinc? They were promised in September.

This is not a developer issue. The announcement was made at techmall.com.

-Tom

 

[SteveL]

Keep in mind that I didn't 'force' anyone to edit their posts, nor did I edit anyone's posts myself. By posting that request, and honoring it, we put the ball in their court, which was my only intention.

Agreed and everyone supported you as best they could. SH has shown their true colors. If they really intended to help people and provide the great customer service they claim to have they would have made a presence here. Had they done that they would have been able to say that all of the negativity was untrue. What they have done is prove a lot (not saying this proves everything) of what people are saying.

As a note...Smarthome does not have a presence on their own board, so it does not have anything to do with Cocoontech personally. The offer still stands for anyone who has a problem with their INSTEON installation that I might be able to help to contact me directly, you are welcome to share your experience with others. With the time I have I can be alot more effective with a phone call than going back and forth in a post for a couple of days. Some days I will have the time but other days it is alot harder. I would encourage anyone that I have spoken with to share any part of it that may be benificial to others on the board.

SteveL

I believe that someone at SH told Dan they would have a presence here if the "negativity was removed. It was removed.... so.... where are they?

I am sure people appreciate your volunteering to help but SH should have kept their commitment to Dan or not made it at all.

Well we can only hope that will happen in time. Is there a question I can help with or was this just a comment.
I would be courious to know what everyones question to Smarthome would be if they were here. If you want me to take a stab at it feel free to contact me.

SteveL

 

[Digger]

Keep in mind that I didn't 'force' anyone to edit their posts, nor did I edit anyone's posts myself. By posting that request, and honoring it, we put the ball in their court, which was my only intention.

Agreed and everyone supported you as best they could. SH has shown their true colors. If they really intended to help people and provide the great customer service they claim to have they would have made a presence here. Had they done that they would have been able to say that all of the negativity was untrue. What they have done is prove a lot (not saying this proves everything) of what people are saying.

As a note...Smarthome does not have a presence on their own board, so it does not have anything to do with Cocoontech personally. The offer still stands for anyone who has a problem with their INSTEON installation that I might be able to help to contact me directly, you are welcome to share your experience with others. With the time I have I can be alot more effective with a phone call than going back and forth in a post for a couple of days. Some days I will have the time but other days it is alot harder. I would encourage anyone that I have spoken with to share any part of it that may be benificial to others on the board.

SteveL

I believe that someone at SH told Dan they would have a presence here if the "negativity was removed. It was removed.... so.... where are they?

I am sure people appreciate your volunteering to help but SH should have kept their commitment to Dan or not made it at all.

Well we can only hope that will happen in time. Is there a question I can help with or was this just a comment.
I would be courious to know what everyones question to Smarthome would be if they were here. If you want me to take a stab at it feel free to contact me.

SteveL

In time? Its been nearly 2 months. I think people want interaction with the actual company not through a moderator on their forum or an unofficial volunteer like yourself here. There seems to be a decent amount of Insteon users here and on Techmall. Why does SH choose to ignore them on both forums? Do you know?

Why do you need specific questions. Why cant SH come here say hello pass on some news and listen to feedback? Then they can use that feedback to improve the company (and then sales most likely). Can Trevor J, Ryan C, Laurie M, or Matt P be allowed one hour a day to participate in the forum (assuming they still work there)?

Mike B in Sales told me that SH is really interested in professional installers and contractors not in the DIY market. To your knowledge is that a true statement?

 

[Digger]

Tfitzpatrick I see you are always reading this thread are you feeding back to SH?

 

[SteveL]

Keep in mind that I didn't 'force' anyone to edit their posts, nor did I edit anyone's posts myself. By posting that request, and honoring it, we put the ball in their court, which was my only intention.

Agreed and everyone supported you as best they could. SH has shown their true colors. If they really intended to help people and provide the great customer service they claim to have they would have made a presence here. Had they done that they would have been able to say that all of the negativity was untrue. What they have done is prove a lot (not saying this proves everything) of what people are saying.

As a note...Smarthome does not have a presence on their own board, so it does not have anything to do with Cocoontech personally. The offer still stands for anyone who has a problem with their INSTEON installation that I might be able to help to contact me directly, you are welcome to share your experience with others. With the time I have I can be alot more effective with a phone call than going back and forth in a post for a couple of days. Some days I will have the time but other days it is alot harder. I would encourage anyone that I have spoken with to share any part of it that may be benificial to others on the board.

SteveL

I believe that someone at SH told Dan they would have a presence here if the "negativity was removed. It was removed.... so.... where are they?

I am sure people appreciate your volunteering to help but SH should have kept their commitment to Dan or not made it at all.

Well we can only hope that will happen in time. Is there a question I can help with or was this just a comment.
I would be courious to know what everyones question to Smarthome would be if they were here. If you want me to take a stab at it feel free to contact me.

SteveL

In time? Its been nearly 2 months. I think people want interaction with the actual company not through a moderator on their forum or an unofficial volunteer like yourself here. There seems to be a decent amount of Insteon users here and on Techmall. Why does SH choose to ignore them on both forums? Do you know?

Why do you need specific questions. Why cant SH come here say hello pass on some news and listen to feedback? Then they can use that feedback to improve the company (and then sales most likely). Can Trevor J, Ryan C, Laurie M, or Matt P be allowed one hour a day to participate in the forum (assuming they still work there)?

Mike B in Sales told me that SH is really interested in professional installers and contractors not in the DIY market. To your knowledge is that a true statement?

If you are wondering if Smarthome sees the comments, they do. They feel that they are user-to-user forums and a place where users help users. People are always welcome to call Smarthome with questions and then come back and post what they found out. I would say that Smarthomepro is mainly focused on professional installers and contractors. Smarthomepro is the part of the company that Mike works for not Smarthome.
You will get as fair and honest an answer from me as anyone, but some things take way to long to discuss on the board and at least for myself I would rather teach someone and have them be able to help others.
I see it this way, there are avenues set up within Smarthome for people to get help, and they are used every day. They have not chosen to use the tech forums as there avenue. They are watched and they are noticed but I do not see them getting on here and dialoging about hop counts and memory maps.
As far as interaction with the company, I am as accessible and willing to talk to somebody about there concerns as anyone. I will be willing to setup a call in bridge if people want to talk to me sometime.
Those that know me know that I can be a great resource. I guess I just do not get the point that if Matt or Trevor are not posting here that you are locked out from communicating with the company...There are plenty of people that would disagree.

SteveL

 

[mustangcoupe]

SteveL,

[soapbox]

I was going to refrain from adding to this thread as I am no longer a insteon user, but your recent post made me want to respond to point out a few things a person standing on the outside sees.... I understand that you are not representing SH here officially on the forum, but you are still asking users to contact you directly about any questions or problems (this makes it appear you are trying to hide the issues, even though I understand you are trying to speed things up this is just user perception), You either missed or skipped a direct question asked of you in this post by xlurker http://www.cocoontech.com/forums/index.php...st&p=110502 the members here wont take offense of you saying either I do not know that answer, or I cant comment on that at this point. But it does feel like they are being ignored when no answer is given. There was another question recently (I can't quickly find to link to it), about i1 vs i2 and which devices are currently being sold that are not i2 compatible, that I did not see an answer to. This question I'm sure is being asked so people don't go out and spend money on something that is still i1 and going to be released with i2 support in the future, and need to spend money on the same item which is now better.

Look around CT, there are a number of manufacturers and vendors here that support their products directly, 1 answering questions about performance and problems, 2 talking about new products when released and 3 just being helpful to other CT members even if their product cant solve their problem. Look at HAI for example, there was some negative comments at one point about them being not DIY friendly and here they are and things have been great with the technical people here to answer the questions. I would actually want to get at least one representative from each manufacturer here to help answer questions about their product and how to do XYZ.... not just SH.

Those that know me know that I can be a great resource. I guess I just do not get the point that if Matt or Trevor are not posting here that you are locked out from communicating with the company...There are plenty of people that would disagree.

YOU have made it known you are not the official voice of SH here, you are here on your personal time to help out(and I thank you for that) but this is why it was asked that Matt or Trevor can officially post here as a SH employee and representative.

[/soapbox]


Thank You for continuing to help out "unofficially" and openly on the forum

 

[SteveL]

The offer still stands for anyone who has a problem with their INSTEON installation that I might be able to help to contact me directly, you are welcome to share your experience with others. With the time I have I can be alot more effective with a phone call than going back and forth in a post for a couple of days. Some days I will have the time but other days it is alot harder. I would encourage anyone that I have spoken with to share any part of it that may be benificial to others on the board.

SteveL

OK, here's one. Where are the user customization tools for the SmartLinc? They were promised in September.

This is not a developer issue. The announcement was made at techmall.com.

-Tom

Tom,

If you want to contact me I can pass along a third party set of files that a developer has put together that will allow you to do some customization. This is not a DIY set of files and Smarthome does not have any support for it since it is not their program. The files I have are at a developer level but you are welcome to try them.

As far as the quote from Trevor I think it was this one. "NetLinc has been designed in such a way where users comfortable with Java-script and .html can create their own interfaces."

What this means is you can send commands to the smartlinc from your own user created interface to control the smartlinc. There are a couple of companies doing it with an iPhone application one of which we were showing at our demo house at EHX last week. I don't believe that was meant to say you can customize you Smartlinc.....but I could be wrong.

SteveL

 

[SteveL]

SteveL,

[soapbox]

I was going to refrain from adding to this thread as I am no longer a insteon user, but your recent post made me want to respond to point out a few things a person standing on the outside sees.... I understand that you are not representing SH here officially on the forum, but you are still asking users to contact you directly about any questions or problems (this makes it appear you are trying to hide the issues, even though I understand you are trying to speed things up this is just user perception), You either missed or skipped a direct question asked of you in this post by xlurker http://www.cocoontech.com/forums/index.php...st&p=110502 the members here wont take offense of you saying either I do not know that answer, or I cant comment on that at this point. But it does feel like they are being ignored when no answer is given. There was another question recently (I can't quickly find to link to it), about i1 vs i2 and which devices are currently being sold that are not i2 compatible, that I did not see an answer to. This question I'm sure is being asked so people don't go out and spend money on something that is still i1 and going to be released with i2 support in the future, and need to spend money on the same item which is now better.

Look around CT, there are a number of manufacturers and vendors here that support their products directly, 1 answering questions about performance and problems, 2 talking about new products when released and 3 just being helpful to other CT members even if their product cant solve their problem. Look at HAI for example, there was some negative comments at one point about them being not DIY friendly and here they are and things have been great with the technical people here to answer the questions. I would actually want to get at least one representative from each manufacturer here to help answer questions about their product and how to do XYZ.... not just SH.

Those that know me know that I can be a great resource. I guess I just do not get the point that if Matt or Trevor are not posting here that you are locked out from communicating with the company...There are plenty of people that would disagree.

YOU have made it known you are not the official voice of SH here, you are here on your personal time to help out(and I thank you for that) but this is why it was asked that Matt or Trevor can officially post here as a SH employee and representative.

[/soapbox]


Thank You for continuing to help out "unofficially" and openly on the forum

With regards to the question of what products are i1 or i2. to the best of my knowledge all RF products are i2, Access Points, Keypad Relays, 600W dimmers, all new products that have just come out are i2. I think as of a month ago 1000W switches and maybe Keypad dimmers shipped i2.

One other note: There are a large group of user where a buying a switch i1 or i2 will not matter to there application. These users manually link the devices and do not use software for there applications .

For those that do use software I understand your interest in wanting to know what device has what.

SteveL

 

[Digger]

Keep in mind that I didn't 'force' anyone to edit their posts, nor did I edit anyone's posts myself. By posting that request, and honoring it, we put the ball in their court, which was my only intention.

Agreed and everyone supported you as best they could. SH has shown their true colors. If they really intended to help people and provide the great customer service they claim to have they would have made a presence here. Had they done that they would have been able to say that all of the negativity was untrue. What they have done is prove a lot (not saying this proves everything) of what people are saying.

As a note...Smarthome does not have a presence on their own board, so it does not have anything to do with Cocoontech personally. The offer still stands for anyone who has a problem with their INSTEON installation that I might be able to help to contact me directly, you are welcome to share your experience with others. With the time I have I can be alot more effective with a phone call than going back and forth in a post for a couple of days. Some days I will have the time but other days it is alot harder. I would encourage anyone that I have spoken with to share any part of it that may be benificial to others on the board.

SteveL

I believe that someone at SH told Dan they would have a presence here if the "negativity was removed. It was removed.... so.... where are they?

I am sure people appreciate your volunteering to help but SH should have kept their commitment to Dan or not made it at all.

Well we can only hope that will happen in time. Is there a question I can help with or was this just a comment.
I would be courious to know what everyones question to Smarthome would be if they were here. If you want me to take a stab at it feel free to contact me.

SteveL

In time? Its been nearly 2 months. I think people want interaction with the actual company not through a moderator on their forum or an unofficial volunteer like yourself here. There seems to be a decent amount of Insteon users here and on Techmall. Why does SH choose to ignore them on both forums? Do you know?

Why do you need specific questions. Why cant SH come here say hello pass on some news and listen to feedback? Then they can use that feedback to improve the company (and then sales most likely). Can Trevor J, Ryan C, Laurie M, or Matt P be allowed one hour a day to participate in the forum (assuming they still work there)?

Mike B in Sales told me that SH is really interested in professional installers and contractors not in the DIY market. To your knowledge is that a true statement?

If you are wondering if Smarthome sees the comments, they do. They feel that they are user-to-user forums and a place where users help users. People are always welcome to call Smarthome with questions and then come back and post what they found out. I would say that Smarthomepro is mainly focused on professional installers and contractors. Smarthomepro is the part of the company that Mike works for not Smarthome.
You will get as fair and honest an answer from me as anyone, but some things take way to long to discuss on the board and at least for myself I would rather teach someone and have them be able to help others.
I see it this way, there are avenues set up within Smarthome for people to get help, and they are used every day. They have not chosen to use the tech forums as there avenue. They are watched and they are noticed but I do not see them getting on here and dialoging about hop counts and memory maps.
As far as interaction with the company, I am as accessible and willing to talk to somebody about there concerns as anyone. I will be willing to setup a call in bridge if people want to talk to me sometime.
Those that know me know that I can be a great resource. I guess I just do not get the point that if Matt or Trevor are not posting here that you are locked out from communicating with the company...There are plenty of people that would disagree.

SteveL

So Steve you make it sound like you ARE representing the company with this post yet you constantly say you are not (As far as interaction with the company, I am as accessible and willing to talk to somebody about there concerns as anyone). Which is it? Are you representing SH?

This forum is not just user to user. There are many mfg's that have representatives actively participate and helping their customers (ELK, HAI, Brultech and many others). This builds a much more loyal customer base.

Why did someone at SH tell Dan they would participate if the "negativity was removed" and then not live up to that? It was just another empty promise from a company with a reputation for that.

I guess I just do not get the point that if Matt or Trevor are not posting here that you are locked out from communicating with the company...There are plenty of people that would disagree.

Anyone disagree?

 

[Digger]

SteveL,

[soapbox]

I was going to refrain from adding to this thread as I am no longer a insteon user, but your recent post made me want to respond to point out a few things a person standing on the outside sees.... I understand that you are not representing SH here officially on the forum, but you are still asking users to contact you directly about any questions or problems (this makes it appear you are trying to hide the issues, even though I understand you are trying to speed things up this is just user perception), You either missed or skipped a direct question asked of you in this post by xlurker http://www.cocoontech.com/forums/index.php...st&p=110502 the members here wont take offense of you saying either I do not know that answer, or I cant comment on that at this point. But it does feel like they are being ignored when no answer is given. There was another question recently (I can't quickly find to link to it), about i1 vs i2 and which devices are currently being sold that are not i2 compatible, that I did not see an answer to. This question I'm sure is being asked so people don't go out and spend money on something that is still i1 and going to be released with i2 support in the future, and need to spend money on the same item which is now better.

Look around CT, there are a number of manufacturers and vendors here that support their products directly, 1 answering questions about performance and problems, 2 talking about new products when released and 3 just being helpful to other CT members even if their product cant solve their problem. Look at HAI for example, there was some negative comments at one point about them being not DIY friendly and here they are and things have been great with the technical people here to answer the questions. I would actually want to get at least one representative from each manufacturer here to help answer questions about their product and how to do XYZ.... not just SH.

Those that know me know that I can be a great resource. I guess I just do not get the point that if Matt or Trevor are not posting here that you are locked out from communicating with the company...There are plenty of people that would disagree.

YOU have made it known you are not the official voice of SH here, you are here on your personal time to help out(and I thank you for that) but this is why it was asked that Matt or Trevor can officially post here as a SH employee and representative.

[/soapbox]


Thank You for continuing to help out "unofficially" and openly on the forum

With regards to the question of what products are i1 or i2. to the best of my knowledge all RF products are i2, Access Points, Keypad Relays, 600W dimmers, all new products that have just come out are i2. I think as of a month ago 1000W switches and maybe Keypad dimmers shipped i2.

One other note: There are a large group of user where a buying a switch i1 or i2 will not matter to there application. These users manually link the devices and do not use software for there applications .

For those that do use software I understand your interest in wanting to know what device has what.

SteveL

What about groups of users that I1 or I2 does matter? Why the secrecy of what device is what? You are probably hurting sales as people are gun shy on buying not knowing what they are getting.

 

[Herdfan]

Mike B in Sales told me that SH is really interested in professional installers and contractors not in the DIY market. To your knowledge is that a true statement?

That is laughable. They are no where near being ready for the professional installers market. Just because they got featured in a magazine as part of a Life/Ware install does not mean they are ready for the big time.

Professionals have a different mindset than the DIY'er. About the second or third trip (unpaid) to go replace a device for a customer would be the last install they did with that company.

 

[jhdale]

With regards to the question of what products are i1 or i2. to the best of my knowledge all RF products are i2, Access Points, Keypad Relays, 600W dimmers, all new products that have just come out are i2. I think as of a month ago 1000W switches and maybe Keypad dimmers shipped i2.

So currently...

i2 Devices
Motion Sensor - always has been
TriggerLinc (not released) - always has been
RemoteLinc - switchover date/version unknown, but before 8/2008, firmware 7C
Access Points - always?
PLM - switchover date/version unknown, at least by 1/2009, firmware 63
KeypadLinc Relays - switchover date/version unknown
SwitchLinc Dimmer 600W - switchover date/version unknown
In-LineLinc with Sense - always has been
IOLinc - always has been
LampLinc - switchover date/version unknown, but before 8/2008, firmware 33 (V4.3)
ApplianceLinc - switchover date/version unknown, but before 9/2008, firmware 32 (V4.1)

SwitchLinc Dimmer 1000W - maybe but only in 2009
KeypadLinc Dimmers - maybe but only in 2009

i1 Devices
PLC - no update to i2 planned
ControlLinc - still i1 - 10/2008, V1.4

No Info
IRLinc
In-LineLinc
OutletLinc
Venstar Thermostat
TimerLinc

(Dates based on purchase date of products I tested.)

Can you fill in anything else?

 

[electron]

We should probably put this data in the INSTEON wiki article, as this is very useful information.

 

[Lagerhead]

[Smarthome has] not chosen to use the tech forums as [their] avenue. They are watched and they are noticed but I do not see them getting on here and dialoging about hop counts and memory maps. . .

I guess I just do not get the point that if Matt or Trevor are not posting here that you are locked out from communicating with the company...There are plenty of people that would disagree.

Steve,

This suggests a few points --
- It is certainly a vendor's prerogative to adopt a non-participation policy (what we have heard to the contrary, via Electron, notwithstanding) (no flames are necessary)
- If that is policy, can we have an authoritative, one-time "say so" that also outlines the effective alternatives, which would mostly finish that point for good?
- Still, even if the policy is that the "corporation" does not participate, it still makes sense for key engineers to participate with corporate blessing, for the mutual value of SH and the CT community.

Whatever the case, personally I think you are to be commended for your courage and persistence in this engagement.

Dave