More LED bulb options

[fester]

does this all mean that CFL's are going to be surpassed by LEDs? I haven't taken a liking to the CFLs at all... they don't seem to perform as well as they claim.. and they certainly don't play well in automation.

Although not an LED light, I've been watching an outfit called Vu1 which looks to have just got UL approval for a CFL which uses a non-filament electron source to light the bulb phosphors like an "old fashioned" CRT. According to them the dimming should play nice with most dimmers and the price looks to be less than LEDs, while still long life.

I guess we'll have to see on that, my "experiment" with an Intermatic Z-wave dimmer resulted in the "magic smoke" releasing in about 4 hours with a "dimmable" CFL.

 

[Odeen]

So, is the extra money for the "extended warranty" or is it actually a different light?

OP - have you tried an electronic dimmer, like a zwave/insteon/x1-/upb dimmer with your LED bulbs? I heard that they require a load in order to work/dim the light.
One fear I have with my investment in lighting control is that it will not be compatible with LED.

AFAIK, only dimmers WITHOUT a neutral connection require a load to work. The switch is powered from the lighting circuit, which work fine with a simple piece of resistive wire (incandescent light) but not with CFL's or LED's. In other words, the circuit is never truly "off", a little power always flows through the switch and the light to keep the switch running.

Dimmers with a neutral connection seem to be able to power themselves independently, and provide a true "off" to the lighting load.

So, if the light can handle the dimmer "chopping" off part of the 120v AC cycle (which incandescents, again, don't care about, but CFL's do), it shoud be able to run off your automated dimmer.

 

[desertdweller]

I picked up an ecosmart cree cr6 light at Home Depot this weekend to test it out. So far I have been extremely impressed. Things I like:

1. It is solidly built, and was very easy to install
2. The light is great. The 2700K color temperature is pretty much identical to the 4 65W incandescent cans next to it. The CR6 appears brighter too.
3. It works just fine with my Web Mountain SW-7 UPB dimmer. The circuit has 4 65W cans plus the CR6 on it. 20% is solid and about the same brightness as the incandescents. At 15%, it flickers very very slightly. 10% it is basically off, flickering just a little bit. 5% it is off.
4. In theory, I won't have to change lightbulbs for 20 years+. My ceilings are 12' so it isn't easy.

Things I'm neutral on:
1. As the CR6 dims, it stays the same 2700K. The incandescents become more orange as the dim down.
2. The trim is bright white. It might be too white for my room, but I'm still deciding. My other cans are black with a white rim. It looks like there are optional trim kits, and that they will cost ~$20 (which seems pricey).

I think this is the future... assuming the price comes down substantially. I really don't see any downsides, other than price.

 

[ano]

So, is the extra money for the "extended warranty" or is it actually a different light?

Another forum explains that the LR6 could be considered the 'lite' version of the CR6: warranty, power consumption, color stabilization, etc.
http://ths.gardenweb.com/forums/load/light...1020024392.html
I don't own either, so no personal experience to back this up; still in exploration stage as well.

I think it might be the other way around. I have many LR6 bulbs and several CR6 bulbs. The LR6 costs more but also puts out more light and more light-per-watt than the CR6 in standard form. (There are a few LR6 variations.) The output looks identical on both, but again, the LR6 is slightly brighter.

The one area where the CR6 does exceed the LR6 is dimming. The CR6 can dim down VERY dim before going out, the LR6 not so much, but one interesting thing. If the CR6 is connected together with incandescent bulbs, at low dimming levels, it actually seems dimmer than the incandescent bulbs, then when moving to 100% it seems to catch up.

So if cost is more important to you than efficiency, the CR6 is the way to go.

 

[gatchel]

Looks like Lowes is selling the Ecosmart/LSG PAR38 or a very very similar model. It's a sylvania brand. 55 Bucks. It's a damn shame that none of these bulbs are certified for direct water contact like every other normal CFL and incandescent on the market for outdoor use. It seems like the LED manufacturers really missed the boat on that one. If they were direct water contact I would have purchased about 10 of them by now...

Why is it that things always have to be half-assed and rushed to market?

 

[ano]

Looks like Lowes is selling the Ecosmart/LSG PAR38 or a very very similar model. It's a sylvania brand. 55 Bucks. It's a damn shame that none of these bulbs are certified for direct water contact like every other normal CFL and incandescent on the market for outdoor use. It seems like the LED manufacturers really missed the boat on that one. If they were direct water contact I would have purchased about 10 of them by now...

Why is it that things always have to be half-assed and rushed to market?

Not fully true. I just purchased an Ecosmart spotlight bulb from HD, with a light output equivalent of 75Watts, and it does in fact state it is for use in damp locations. No its not 100% waterproof, but it will work in locations where its protected. I use them outside in a spotlight fixture and they run great.

http://www.homedepot.com/buy/lighting-fans...bulb-39642.html

It says right in the ad, inside or outside.

 

[gatchel]

Looks like Lowes is selling the Ecosmart/LSG PAR38 or a very very similar model. It's a sylvania brand. 55 Bucks. It's a damn shame that none of these bulbs are certified for direct water contact like every other normal CFL and incandescent on the market for outdoor use. It seems like the LED manufacturers really missed the boat on that one. If they were direct water contact I would have purchased about 10 of them by now...

Why is it that things always have to be half-assed and rushed to market?

Not fully true. I just purchased an Ecosmart spotlight bulb from HD, with a light output equivalent of 75Watts, and it does in fact state it is for use in damp locations. No its not 100% waterproof, but it will work in locations where its protected. I use them outside in a spotlight fixture and they run great.

http://www.homedepot.com/buy/lighting-fans...bulb-39642.html

It says right in the ad, inside or outside.

I called LSG and asked them to clarify the damp rating... It must be 100% covered from rain hitting it in any way. If you have the traditional lamp sockets that only cover a bit past the edison base and do not cover the whole lamp itself you are using the lamp outside of its design characteristics.

This is the socket style I have which is a no no according to LSG:

http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc1vZ1xgy...catalogId=10053


I plan to see if the lamps will fit completely into this style and if they do then we are game:

http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc1vZ1xgy...catalogId=10053


If you could shed some light as to what socket you are using, and it covers the bulb then you will have made my day. (And cost me a lot of money )

 

[ano]

If you could shed some light as to what socket you are using, and it covers the bulb then you will have made my day. (And cost me a lot of money )

I use these:
http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc1vZ1xg6...catalogId=10053

Believe it or not, our home owners association requires that the spotlight be fully covered, so I could only use these.

 

[gatchel]

If you could shed some light as to what socket you are using, and it covers the bulb then you will have made my day. (And cost me a lot of money )

I use these:
http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc1vZ1xg6...catalogId=10053

Believe it or not, our home owners association requires that the spotlight be fully covered, so I could only use these.

Awesome! Believe it or not, I was actually going to go to HD tonight to see if someone in electrical could help by taking one of the bulbs and trying them in that exact fixture (but white). You saved the HD person and me a bunch of hassle. Thanks for the information. I sincerely appreciate it.

Also, Imaging that, a homeowners association that actually has good taste in lighting

 

[gatchel]

I use these:
http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc1vZ1xg6...catalogId=10053

Believe it or not, our home owners association requires that the spotlight be fully covered, so I could only use these.

Thank you for the help. I have 3 of the PAR-38 lamps on the driveway in place of the old dual 150 watt halogen lamps. Much, much better.

 

[ano]

I use these:
http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc1vZ1xg6...catalogId=10053

Believe it or not, our home owners association requires that the spotlight be fully covered, so I could only use these.

Thank you for the help. I have 3 of the PAR-38 lamps on the driveway in place of the old dual 150 watt halogen lamps. Much, much better.

Yup. For me 36 watts is much better than 180 watts, and just about as bright.

 

[electron]

I am guessing it's time to create a 'List' for bulbs which are HA/Dimmer friendly. Add the ability to filter based on lumens etc, I think it might be pretty useful. What do you guys think?

 

[pete_c]

I'm waiting to replace all my outdoor "coach lamps". I tried a CCFL replacement a couple of years back and wasn't happy. On the same note though I use clear standard base (with a kind of crystalline look) candlelabra type bulbs. I also utilize all clear bulbs on any lamps in the house (with lamp shades). Guess that's the old fashioned part of me. Its kind of wanting a certain "look" of the lamps more than just function power requirements of the lamps. The chandelier today is using just clear bulbs (long life) and I've only had to replace maybe one in the last 5 years or so. Having a "lift" on it makes it easy in a way such that I can just lower it to change the bulbs - but its more the physical "look" of the chandelier versus the power savings piece. I did purchase a 1000W plus UPB switch for the setup to replace the current Insteon 1000W setup but haven't attempted yet to swap it out. Its also in a 3-way with about 4 other switches (which isn't a big deal).

I've also been redoing my garage a bit at a time. My old garage was set up shop like to be able to work on my cars and I ended up putting at least 8 rows of 24 feet of flourescent lighting in it so it was like daylight. Thinking of a similar endeavor here but maybe using LED's. I've started very small by putting 120VAC LED lighting under two "work cabinets" (along with a sink etc). Its not a big deal to add surface mounted lighting to the ceiling (running some conduit etc). I have winter/summer tires for two vehicles and want to add "racks" on one side of the garage for this piece of the endeavor first.

The kitchen cans though would be another "deal" as my wife is very particular about the "light" while she cooks and she seems to keep all of the cans on 100% while doing anything in the kitchen. I might be able to switch out 2-3 cans on separate switches in the kitchen and see if she notices the difference. On a tangent look my nephew used to work (and may return) to working corporate in a big box HW store and I used to bug him all the time about this kind of stuff. (he was getting involved in being a buyer) so I can start to bug him again about low energy lighting.

 

[DIYHO]

I am also in the process of trying to decide how to outfit my cans, with lamps or with the Cree's.

I will echo the comments made by ano on the LR6 vs. the CR6 and add the LR6 has a significantly better heat sink and they are commercial rated. The LR6 is the best bang for the buck IMO, especially if you are dealing with heat, assuming you can live with the difference in the dimming.

I will also throw another LED lamp into the mix that looks very promising from Nexxus

http://www.arraylighting.com/

Spec for spec, the big box offerings are not even close. If anyone has tried these, please give your thoughts on them.

 

[pete_c]

I understand that sometimes the big box stores cut deals with mfgs for product and quality suffers. Competition with prices and quality may stimulate better bulbs though.

It does appear though that eventually there will be a sort of phasing out of incandescent bulbs toward an energy saving methodology. Many years ago in the 1980's I would purchase specialty bulbs for commercial use. They were a bit more expensive but rarely replaced. I still have a couple of cases of those bulbs and ones in place haven't needed to be replaced yet in about 6-7 years. The clear bulbs in my chandelier for example.

Our Jenn Air grill purchased for close to $1000 5 years ago from Lowes still looks good on the outside but the insides have to be replaced. In the old home purchased a name brand (think Char-Broil) from a specialty shop at around same price and it lasted 25 years. My sister purchased a Brinkman from a big box HW store about 3 years ago and it also looks a bit "worn" these days. On the same note the replacement parts are much less in cost than the Char-Broil parts were (one grate was $200 when finally needing to be replaced).