Pet Peeve as a pro

[Del91574]

I was peeking through the gallery and I noticed another "pro" that put up pictures of their install(s) and "conduit" that they ran. All their "conduit" was white and they mentioned the PVC 90* fittings they normally used vs. the LB's (they didn't call them that) that they used on this install.

I put the quotes around the conduit because the fittings, pipe and related hardware were all plumbing fittings and pipe, with the exception of their newly discovered LB's they must've just seen at Home Depot.

Installers and installs like that, including the lack of knockout bushings, grommets and appropriate fittings in these sorts of installs, especially when they're supposed to be professional and up to code, puts the whole business and industry in a poor light, and frankly, those people are barely a step above a trunkslammer.

While I can understand some of the installs and custom made hardware (as some want to homebrew their own solutions) however I am disappointed in the other installs that frankly are appalling when viewed for the violations they show, then their install is applauded as a great and clean project.

 

[mikejrc]

I'm not impressed by your work either, so what's your point? I have worked on installations on a scale that would put yours to shame, but I don't go around posting pictures and bragging about it. Nobody likes your attitude, as a pro please help others without having to "prove and show" how much you know.
my two cents

 

[Neurorad]

DEL, link or pic? Would help tremendously to see what is considered right or wrong, in your opinion.

 

[fcwilt]

Yes, please, what pictures are we talking about?

 

[Neurorad]

I think that's his own house, not sure if he is a pro installer, if it's the one I found.

Please be less critical. I'm sure others could find faults with your work, DEL.

 

[electron]

I personally hate negative posts. It would have been pretty easy to put a positive spin on this thread, and make it so others can learn from possible mistakes or bad design/planning. Instead, it looks like it's just a random attack on a competitor (since you mention 'Pro').

My setup will probably give you a heart attack as well, but if you want to show how something is done right, why not focus on that instead, and educate us? I know I would appreciate it, and in the mean time, you convey your message

 

[video321]

Ahhh....that fine line.

I agree that you could easily have gotten your point across by simply stating what you've seen, in general, from some galleries and what a "pro" would do to make it better and/or up to code. All of that could have been done without calling anyone out. And from being in the gallery recently myself I know what you're referring to, but you know what...I've used schedule 40 for simple conduit runs if I had it laying around my house. Heck...my current media closet is using a small 3" wide piece that I got from a plumber friend of mine so I didn't have to buy any for such a small task (I don't care that it would cost $3 when there is no reason to spend it!) And, yes, I do know the difference between LBs, LRs, LLs and the such.

I'm new here and so are you. You've replied in my posts and I totally appreciate your opinion and knowledge so I would like to see you continue to be a contributor around here.

 

[electron]

He is talking about a 'pro' tho.

 

[ver0776]

I think a Pro should also just be judged by work they charged for.

I know Pro painters with paint falling off their houses, and Pro plumbers with crappy patches on their own pipes.

I would never do the things I have done in my own house to another's house... When it is my house I am working on, I will do it however I want, regardless of if I am a professional or not. I might not put it on an advertisement or anything, but still.. I am not paying myself $2k or anything, so I am not bound by any standards concerning my own house.

Vaughn

 

[Del91574]

I'm not impressed by your work either, so what's your point? I have worked on installations on a scale that would put yours to shame, but I don't go around posting pictures and bragging about it. Nobody likes your attitude, as a pro please help others without having to "prove and show" how much you know.
my two cents

Come and visit one of my installs, you've never seen my work outside of what I have posted for a couple of pictures of wire runs. Honestly, you're negativity towards me was given when wiring methods came into question and honestly, I don't think you understood the wiring methods or best practices.

Honestly, I placed you on ignore since your initial attack on what is right or wrong. Maybe I misinterpreted it, but maybe in your past experiences and installs they sounded far different that what I've had to install and comply with using the NEC, UL and NFPA.

 

[Del91574]

I personally hate negative posts. It would have been pretty easy to put a positive spin on this thread, and make it so others can learn from possible mistakes or bad design/planning. Instead, it looks like it's just a random attack on a competitor (since you mention 'Pro').

My setup will probably give you a heart attack as well, but if you want to show how something is done right, why not focus on that instead, and educate us? I know I would appreciate it, and in the mean time, you convey your message

Dan, I'll share via PM if it's of interest, but I didn't set out for this to be an attack on them or myself, as it has turned out to be, only a statement of how poor practices reflect on the industry and honest integrators out there. I can't post gallery pictures, only in posts themselves.

I'm not going to call the person out in public period, that's low class and lack of couth, especially someone that is supposed to be in the trade and posting their own house, which I know in my case, I use for a showpiece as well as have in my portfolio, in addition to paying clientele and boilerplate panels that I allow people to play with while they are shopping systems.

Not an attack on a competitor at all, they're across the country from me, just was somewhat shocked by someone that posted as a Pro in the gallery that was using plumbing 90's, 45's and other fittings for 120V electrical and their connections to an occasional genuine electrical fitting, including their LV wiring, their own house or not, because if it's not worth doing correctly, then what's the point of doing it in the first place?

My point was as Video321's post appears to have understood. My point was that this stuff should be properly installed and implemented, as poor installation methodology and practices put the whole automation, integration and security industry in a poor light because of what people are slamming together, their own house or not, it should be put in right irregardless.

As a case in point, this is a current rough in as of Monday...in process. No wiring has been final dressed, just dropped and hung for inspection for the first 3 floors.

Sense of scale for wire bundles:

That is LV security,fire and CO, structured, MAC-6, Siamese coax analog CCTV, siamese Cat 6 (HDMI and Zigbee), Cat 6 for audio keypads and multiple zones of distributed audio. This is not including the control circuits (continous loop) for Vantage lighting control, which is in another mechanical room. There is still more wiring to be done, including all the automation for the irrigation, pool control, landscape wiring/audio and the detached poolhouse.

 

[AnthonyZ]

A guy who runs wire for Zigbee has no business criticizing anyone.

 

[wuench]

The tone of this thread is definitely unfortunate because I would really like to know the reasoning against using PVC plumbing "conduit" for low voltage wiring and whether it is really "against code" or just "bad practice". I have used white PVC for runs before (just in my own home, I am no pro) mostly because the selection for electrical conduit at the home center isn't very complete. Is color just to be able to determine what is plumbing and what is low voltage wiring?

 

[Paul]

Can't we all just be friendly?

Talking shit on someone's wiring job is a lot easier than saying "hey you know what you could have done better there?". I know it's easy to be an e-thug when you're wearing a cloak of internet anonymity, but seriously guys, you can leave your digital ecko sweatsuits and gold teeth at the door.

 

[tmbrown97]

So when it comes to things involving electronics and wiring and all that, I get how things work - I'm an engineer to my core - but, I lack practical experience and attention to detail when it comes to applying that to a nice wiring job. What that means is my stuff will always work - and I'll know why it works and how it works better than many of the people who install it for a living... so while I may have more functionality out of my system, it'll probably look like crap compared to a pro system!

For years I've dealt with that - I can't stand talking to a "pro" whether it's automotive electronics, security, etc - if they have that holier-than-thou attitude - like everyone else is a bunch of morons and everyone's bringing them down and people shouldn't be playing in their space. I refuse to hire a person like that no matter how knowledgable they are.

DEL - you rubbed me wrong from the beginning and I was a bit harsh in return - for that very reason - but, I see when I look at your posts that quite often you do have good information mixed in with all that attitude. If you could skip the "I'm better than all of you and here's why!" attitude and stick to simple facts, without putting anyone down or having to tell us all how great you are, I think you'd get a lot more respect on these forums. Your knowledge appears to be solid - and you do provide helpful information a lot of times. Just try being a little more humble. If you're genuine and your information is accurate, people will come to respect you without you having to jump up and down demanding said respect - and people will probably be less put-off by your posts.

Your knowledge and experience are valuable and people will come to respect you for that alone if given the chance.