Question about Elk/Insteon/mControl system

[geekinc]

I am a noob in the home automation game, but I do have a high level of understanding of networks and most shiny things that beep.

What I have:

Windows Home Server running mControl
Insteon 2414u USB PLC
Elk M1G with Ethernet module
Irrigation Controller (Insteon)
Appliance Module (Insteon)
IP Camera

What I want to do:

The appliance module is connected to my hot water recirc pump and I want to use the Elk keypads to start and stop the pump and eventually control the irrigation, etc.

What's the best route from here to there. I am not very impressed with the mControl interfaces so I am not tied into using that, although I would like to get some use out of it since it is not returnable. I blame myself for not downloading the trial(but what good is the trial when you don't have any of the other devices anyway??)

I use both Macs and PCs and have both running on my network, which is all wired and running via gigabit switches through out.

Thanks

 

[Spanky]

Write a Rule that defines one of the Tasks in the M1 to turn the pump On and Off. Usually two Rules, a Task to turn it On and a Task to turn if Off.


With the Task defined you can activate the Task with:
1. A Function Key on a Keypad
2. The M1's Telephone Remote Control capability
3. A serial ASCII string coming from a PC or Touchscreen
4. Another Rule that may be set on a timed event
5. A lighting device command. ie. A button on a light plate can be programmed to control a Task through a Rule

Virtually any event can control a Task.

 

[geekinc]

Write a Rule that defines one of the Tasks in the M1 to turn the pump On and Off. Usually two Rules, a Task to turn it On and a Task to turn if Off.

How do I get the M1 to talk to the Insteon Appliance Linc, is it possible to do with the M1XEP? and the USB PLC?

I thought I could possibly use the mControl to watch the M1 for status changes, but it only allows alarm or zone status changes, I couldn't find a way to watch for button presses.

I actually need to write a task or macro to run the pump for 15 minutes so it is not running all day if we forget to kill it when we are done with the showers in the morning, or doing dishes in the evening, etc.

 

[Steve]

I think you need the 2414S to hook it up to the M1. You also need an M1XSP serial expander with the Insteon firmware. Or, if you want to just use the network (XEP) I think you can use the ISY-99, it seems to be pretty popular for the Insteon crowd. Once you have the right parts and hookup you can do as Spanky said. The alternative would be to hood the 2414U to the pc running mControl but I'm not sure how mControl and Elk interface, if there is a driver, etc.

On another note, what recirc pump are you using with the appliance module?

 

[fcwilt]

Hi,

Welcome to the money pit! Home automation has a way of taking over as you think of more things you can do.

In any case have you ever looked at UPB devices instead of Insteon? I gave up on Insteon. I also found that the configuration program for UPB (UPstart) makes setting up and maintaining a UPB "network" a breeze.

Now you can use the M1 as your primary home automation controller or you can use it as the security part of another home automation system. In my home the M1 is attached to my primary home automation system HomeLogic BUT I make use of the capabilities of the M1 to extend the capabilities of the HomeLogic system. The M1 also serves as the security system for the home and is controlled by the HomeLogic system.

If you are looking for a software solution to a home automation controller running on a Windows box you can check out MainLobby (http://www.cinemarsolutions.com/) or Charmed Quark Controller (http://www.charmedquark.com/).

One of the major items you need to keep your eye on is if a given home automation system supports the devices and sub-systems you would like to have in your home.

 

[geekinc]

I think you need the 2414S to hook it up to the M1. You also need an M1XSP serial expander with the Insteon firmware. Or, if you want to just use the network (XEP) I think you can use the ISY-99, it seems to be pretty popular for the Insteon crowd. Once you have the right parts and hookup you can do as Spanky said. The alternative would be to hood the 2414U to the pc running mControl but I'm not sure how mControl and Elk interface, if there is a driver, etc.

On another note, what recirc pump are you using with the appliance module?

The 2414u is connected to my Windows Home Server which is hosting mControl, but the support from mControl seems to be only limited. I am contacting them to see what, if anything can be done. Their documentation is very limited as to what is supported, it just shows that mControl supports the Elk M1G via serial or Ethernet.

I have a Taco recirc pump that was supplied by the home builder, it was speced as a Grundfos model, but that changed at some point. I did a little homework and their didn't seem to be a big difference in price, or reliability so I let it slide.

My main reason for going Insteon, was the irrigation controller. It was the gateway of choice into this deep dark world, and since the landscapers were charging $400 for a non connected controller, I showed the wife what a connected controller cost(but not the other required items) and went shopping.

I did not read the Insteon horror thread, but so far it has been working almost perfectly except on certain computers the USB PLC connects right away and on some it takes a few rounds of plugging and unplugging to get it recognized correctly. Smarthome has offered to replace it, and if that doesn't work they may let me return the USB PLC and mControl software, even though it is technically opened.

For this to make sense, I need to be able to have the wife be able to reliably use the system and so far it is too complicated. Our home pc is a Mac and the mControl http interface does not play well with the Mac, so as of now, I have to remote into the server or my windows machine hidden away in my server closet, which is not the most elegant solution.

 

[apostolakisl]

Hello,

I am running the Elk M1G and Insteon. I use the Elk as my primary HA controller. I wired the Elk to control the irrigation directly via it's relays. I have 16 zones so I bought Elk relay board expanders. I got a 24v transformer and wired one leg accross one contact on all of the relays, the other leg to the common on the sprinkler valves. The individual wires on the valves go to the other side of each relay contact. I wrote a couple of programs for the Elk (which I will share with you if you like) to control the irrigation system. It has worked great for about a month now. I set the f5 key to start the sprinkler and f6 to advance zones plus a task to shut down instantly. I will be adding a rain sensor to one of the zone inputs and will put a rule to not water if the rain sensor is tripped. I wrote the code so that pushing f5 starts zone 1 and then each subsequent zone is triggered by the previous zone shutting off. I wrote another set of code that says whenever f6 is pushed and zone x is on, then turn it off. This is the zone advance feature as it is located before the other rules which respond to whenever a zone is shut off the next turns on. Lastly I wrote a set of code that says whenver task x is activated and zone x is on then turn it off but put it after the original code so it just shuts the whole thing off rather than zone advance.

You will need to get the serial port expander (xsp) and the Insteon serial connector (2412s or 2414s) to connect Elk to Insteon for running your recirc pump. You can use an appliance linc and right a rule for the elk that says something like whenever it is 8 am then turn appliance linc on for 10 minutes. Or whenever f5 is pushed. .. or whenever motion detector in bathroom is tripped and it is a certain time of day, turn on pump for 10 minutes. The possibilities are limited by your imagination. I have thought it would be nice to have a flow detector on the water line so that whenever you turn on the hot water it trips the pump. While this won't make "instant" hot water it will hugely speed up how long it takes the water to be at the faucet and will only ever run when you actually are using hot water.

The nice thing about using the elk to run things like this is that you can make events happen using rules that include zone status, keypad controls, time status, light status, and a lot of other things in your rules for setting when to make and event happen.

 

[Digger]

Hello,

I am running the Elk M1G and Insteon. I use the Elk as my primary HA controller. I wired the Elk to control the irrigation directly via it's relays. I have 16 zones so I bought Elk relay board expanders. I got a 24v transformer and wired one leg accross one contact on all of the relays, the other leg to the common on the sprinkler valves. The individual wires on the valves go to the other side of each relay contact. I wrote a couple of programs for the Elk (which I will share with you if you like) to control the irrigation system. It has worked great for about a month now. I set the f5 key to start the sprinkler and f6 to advance zones plus a task to shut down instantly. I will be adding a rain sensor to one of the zone inputs and will put a rule to not water if the rain sensor is tripped. I wrote the code so that pushing f5 starts zone 1 and then each subsequent zone is triggered by the previous zone shutting off. I wrote another set of code that says whenever f6 is pushed and zone x is on, then turn it off. This is the zone advance feature as it is located before the other rules which respond to whenever a zone is shut off the next turns on. Lastly I wrote a set of code that says whenver task x is activated and zone x is on then turn it off but put it after the original code so it just shuts the whole thing off rather than zone advance.

You will need to get the serial port expander (xsp) and the Insteon serial connector (2412s or 2414s) to connect Elk to Insteon for running your recirc pump. You can use an appliance linc and right a rule for the elk that says something like whenever it is 8 am then turn appliance linc on for 10 minutes. Or whenever f5 is pushed. .. or whenever motion detector in bathroom is tripped and it is a certain time of day, turn on pump for 10 minutes. The possibilities are limited by your imagination. I have thought it would be nice to have a flow detector on the water line so that whenever you turn on the hot water it trips the pump. While this won't make "instant" hot water it will hugely speed up how long it takes the water to be at the faucet and will only ever run when you actually are using hot water.

The nice thing about using the elk to run things like this is that you can make events happen using rules that include zone status, keypad controls, time status, light status, and a lot of other things in your rules for setting when to make and event happen.

Very nice job with the sprinkler control. Maybe you could post that in a new thread as I think alot of people might want to look at your rules setup. I did something close to what you did but you really perfected it compared to mine.