Running another cat5 wire...

[beelzerob]

Turns out I have to add a cat5 wire to a gang box by the front door. Currently in that gang box is a cat5 wire that comes up directly from the basement below.

I'm not very versed in fishing a wire up. Adding to the difficulty, it's an outer wall, so it has insulation in it (bat, not blown).

Do you think that I should add some nylon to the existing cat5, pull it down to the basement, add the other cat5 to it, and then pull both back up with the nylon? The advantage is it should be able to find its way from the hole to the gang box through the insulation. Or, should I just drill another hole and try to push my fishing metal thing up from below until I find the gang box?

Here's the culprit, pre insulation and sheetrock

Even if I were able to fish that up from below, how do I get it to the top of the box where I can connect it with the ALC switch? It's a tight squeeze around the box and sheetrock opening.

 

[mdesmarais]

Pull it. Way easier. I did it for a two floor run just a couple of weeks ago. Just make sure the strings are very secure, and tape smoothly so it won't snag.

 

[Steve]

Is the hole in the footer large enough for 2 cat5's, a pull string and tape?

 

[beelzerob]

Is the hole in the footer large enough for 2 cat5's, a pull string and tape?

Weeellll..that's a good question. Not to mention we sprayed foam in it, as you can see. So it may be a tight fit. If I can pull the cat5 down from there with nylon attached, then that'll give me some room to scrape out foam maybe with a screwdriver.

I might risk drilling a larger hole right next to it, close enough to slide the nylon over.

 

[Sokoloff]

Spray foam will make it substantially harder as that stuff is an effective glue and pseudo-structural member.

If you can, I'd hedge my bets by taping the new Cat5 to the old and pulling it through the blind section without ever fully removing the existing Cat5. That way, if it fails, you aren't down to zero Cat5. (Nothing angers me more than that... :throwup: )

Edit: sorry, I didn't realize you were post-sheetrock. You still might be able to do that from below (tape it below and pull it "up"), but that means unterminating it from the basement, which you may not want to do.

Fishing that, unless you're cutting sheetrock, is going to be damned difficult. If it's a solid color paint finish, you may just want to take a stab at it, but be very willing to fall back to doing sheetrock repair and re-paint as needed. (Plaster, faux finish, wallpaper, etc might make that unworkable.)

 

[Monk]

Is the hole in the footer large enough for 2 cat5's, a pull string and tape?

Weeellll..that's a good question. Not to mention we sprayed foam in it, as you can see. So it may be a tight fit. If I can pull the cat5 down from there with nylon attached, then that'll give me some room to scrape out foam maybe with a screwdriver.

I might risk drilling a larger hole right next to it, close enough to slide the nylon over.

Drill a bigger hole if you need, then drop a chain down from the top if the insulation isn't in the way... I've used one of these in a lot of after-work situations...
http://lsdinc.com/content/product_details/62

EDIT: Or push a stick up from beneath if that works better....

 

[Neurorad]

Use a pull cord/string, attaching it to the existing cat 5, and pull both cat5's back up together with the cord. If you have to mash up the existing cable to get it throug the hole, trim the end of the cable.

If that fails, put 'fish sticks' or tape down from above, through the enlarged hole, or through a second hole drilled at the back of the stud bay (easier to hit with the sticks/tape).

Even though there is insulation bat, it looks like such a straight shot. Nice job with the photo pre-drywall. Too bad the old hole is so well-centered.

You may want to consider adding 2 new cat5's - one of those switches for landscape lighting?

 

[sbwright]

If you have straight in access from below try a small dia. dowell(1/4" or less), sharpen the end like a pencil so that it will slice easily thru the insulation. Drill a small hole thru the sharpened end feed 1 or 2 of the cat 5 conductors thru the hole to secure it, but so it will be easy to pull a part from above at the box.

If you are trying to go into the box a second person above should be able to guide the dowell into the box, may need to cut away small amount of drywall below box, coverplate should still cover.

It will be hard to push a fish tape straight up to the box thru insulation without it wandering. Failing that I think Sokoloff has the best way to ensure success.

Just a thought,

 

[Sandpiper]

Turns out I have to add a cat5 wire to a gang box by the front door. Currently in that gang box is a cat5 wire that comes up directly from the basement below.

I'm not very versed in fishing a wire up. Adding to the difficulty, it's an outer wall, so it has insulation in it (bat, not blown).

Do you think that I should add some nylon to the existing cat5, pull it down to the basement, add the other cat5 to it, and then pull both back up with the nylon? The advantage is it should be able to find its way from the hole to the gang box through the insulation. Or, should I just drill another hole and try to push my fishing metal thing up from below until I find the gang box?

Here's the culprit, pre insulation and sheetrock

Even if I were able to fish that up from below, how do I get it to the top of the box where I can connect it with the ALC switch? It's a tight squeeze around the box and sheetrock opening.

Nice job on the photo. It helps explain the situation tremendously. I do professional installations and have done many like this. So here is how I would do it, but of course, using my professional tools:

1. From the crawl space below, drill up. The placement and angle of the drill is important. I would put the new hole, just to the left of the existing yellow cat5. Angle the bit vertical but slant it back towards the chip board sheathing (away from the drywall) about 5 to 10 degrees.

2. Using a glass rod with an 8 inch section of magnetic chain attached to it, run it up the hole. Measure how far the rod needs to run, as you want just the right amount of rod there for the chain to be right behind the box. By angle drilling, the glass rod will go up the wall behind the insulation instead of through it, but it will also go behind the box.

3. Now at the box, cut the drywall a bit above the box to make room to do some fishing. 1/4 to 3/8" gap should be enough. The cover plate will cover the gap.

4. Using a magnet on a flexible wire (we use what is called a wet noodle), insert in the gap and find the chain and pull it out.

5. Now just attach your wire to the chain and pull it down.

Now if you don't have magnetic chain and a wet noodle, you can try piece of #22 wire attached to the end of a glass rod. But now you have to see it and grab it with long needle nose pliers through the gap.

 

[beelzerob]

All fantastic suggestions, thanks!

You may want to consider adding 2 new cat5's - one of those switches for landscape lighting?

No, I thankfully thought enough ahead on the landscape lighting to hide it in a closet. Those switches are for front lights, foyer lights, and lights on the 2nd floor walkway (since the stairs are right there).

With OnQ, adding another cat5 is enough to handle all 3 of those switches. If I end up some day scrapping OnQ and going with some other lighting technology that requires a cat5 per switch, then I'm screwed throughout the entire house, so no worries here.

Ya know, as an aside, I realize now that I don't have the cat5 around that I would need in order to run this 2nd wire all the way to the wiring room.

If you can, I'd hedge my bets by taping the new Cat5 to the old and pulling it through the blind section without ever fully removing the existing Cat5. That way, if it fails, you aren't down to zero Cat5. (Nothing angers me more than that... smile.gif )

Well, I'd originally thought that wasn't possible, as the cat5 is ran all the way to the wiring room. But it's not terminated at all yet, and it only runs through the basement ceiling, so I could actually free up that cat5 wire enough so I could pull it through with the additional cat5 attached if needed.

Great idea, Monk! I hadn't thought of a straight rod. Any particular reason for a glass rod, Sandpiper? I don't have any of those around. However, I could get a wooden dowel easy enough, like sbwright suggests. I THINK those come in lengths long enough to reach.

So I guess first I'm going to have to figure out where to get more cat5 without breaking the bank, and figure out how much I need first.

 

[WayneW]

Any particular reason for a glass rod, Sandpiper? I don't have any of those around. However, I could get a wooden dowel easy enough, like sbwright suggests. I THINK those come in lengths long enough to reach.

I assume he means a fiberglass rod.
http://www.lsdinc.com/content/product_details/51
http://www.lsdinc.com/content/product_details/97
Similar stuff should be available at HD/Lowes, under a different brand.

 

[beelzerob]

Ah, ok. I'll look for those.

I wasn't really excited about the idea of pushing a glass rod into the basement ceiling from underneath...

 

[beelzerob]

Hmm...now that I think about it...I'm really only lacking 3 conductors. That's all I need to make 3 ALC switches work there. Well, I have a box of 22/4, should be PLENTY to reach. And the 22/4 is thinner and more flexible than another cat5 would be. There's a ban on new purchases currently, so using the 22/4 would let me actually undertake this this weekend, instead of having to wait for purchase approval and then delivery of more cat5.

Hmmm.

 

[sic0048]

Sounds like you have a weekend project

 

[beelzerob]

Sounds like you have a weekend project

Oh, that's never been an problem. It's always just a question of which. I try to narrow it down to only 3 or so different things that HAVE to get done over the weekend.

I don't mind so much. I only covet my weekends during football season.