What is wrong with CQC?

Awesome to hear Dean!!!!!
I like that statement Ano.  And I think its become the expected design approach at this point for most software (or computers, cars, games, etc etc).  Aim for the simple face, with depth for those willing to explore/utilize it.
 
I still think a default recommended set of equipment would assist as well .  i.e. have an awesome interface designed if you use HAI alarm*, Zwave lights, Nest thermostats, and Yamaha Receivers. (or whatever mix is best for CQC to maintain absolute up to date support).  Think of it as your installers base setup for their most common use scenario.
 
You know, maybe you can get ahead of the Amazon Echo everyone been discussing and make that part of the defualt.  Become the defacto HA software to interact with Echo for HA.  That could be a huge boon and get you a ton of additional traffic to the site as well.
 
*I said HAI as thats what I have...and I am biased  :D
 
As it stands now, you can have a nice set of interfaces if you use V2 driver compliant gear. If there's a V2 driver for it, then it should be supportable without any big effort via the room configuration -> Auto-Generation system. The HAI, Z-Wave, and Yamaha receivers (that implement their YANC (?) protocol) are in that list. The Nest isn't quite yet. There's an older V1 style driver for that currently, which was written before the protocol was formally exposed.
 
Here's are couple little quick and dirty demo videos of some of the new UI that's been done so far. 
 
http://www.charmedquark.com/Web2/PostImages/5_0Previews/NewUIPreview4.wmv
 
Stuff to note in this one.
 
1. There's now an integrated tree type browser on the left for getting to stuff. So it's not spread out into different (modal) dialogs and things like that. A few things that hadn't been moved to hierarchical storage have been updated to be so now, in order to fit into this new scheme. Though not visible, another benefit is that the back end file management has also now been completely consolidated to match, which is a good improvement as well. Previously it was done via type specific remote interfaces (template, global actions, images, etc... had their own separate access interfaces, caching mechanisms, etc...)
 
What you don't see in the browser tree in this demo is the other stuff that needs to be manageable, like hosts, drivers, and tools. Those will come soon. 
 
2. A very different look. It's vastly less modal, and we're being careful to maintain a specific style, deal with button positions and the like consistently.
 
3. Nice, smoothly sliding pane oriented interface. The smoothly sliding part is not easy, but I worked it out eventually. 
 
4. Also, something you don't see here is that I have worked out a nice attribute editor type control (of the usual sort where it shows you a list of names and values of editable attributes of the thing selected and provides a consolidated, non-modal interface to edit those attributes, mostly 'in place' type editing. That will be used heavily in the interface editor, replacing the previously modal attribute dialog. I am using that control internally already in my dialog editor, so I know it's good to go.
 
5. You see an early version of the CML language IDE (now integrated into the main admin client as other tools will be.) It's almost completely fleshed out in the next video below.
 
6. Images can be imported into CQC by just dragging them into the tree browser. This replaces the old, clunky and not much loved, image import dialog. Currently images are the only things you'd pull into CQC from the outside world, but if other things come up they can be done similarly.
 
 
http://www.charmedquark.com/Web2/PostImages/5_0Previews/NewUIPreview7.wmv
 
Things to note in this one:
 
1. General movement towards 'edit in place' where it is reasonable to do so, which again gets rid of modality and reduces work on my part since it reuses generic editing mechanisms.
 
2. Almost fully completed CML IDE, which is one of the more GUI'ed bits involved, so it's been used as a test bed to work out the new windowing framework.
 
3. Syntax highlighting in the CML editor.
 
Good stuff, Dean!
 
Question about what happened when you clicked the "Test2" macro in the treeview. Did you right-click it to get the popup menu (offering to View, Edit, Delete, etc)? If so, what is the default mode if you just left-click "Test2"? I figure the least friction would be to left-click the Macro name and have its contents immediately available for editing.
 
Actually, the two schemes are double click opens things for viewing only, read only. In the case of a macro, it doesn't open the IDE it just opens it up in a scrollable text display window. But similar for all other resources, where either or both of them make sense and at least one always does.
 
Editing is the heavier scenario, so it requires the popup menu via right click, then select edit. A regular (single) left click only selects the item in the tree, which is the normal thing for that sort of control. There's also hot keys as well, so you could get to the edit or view that way also, by just selecting the item and hitting the hot key.
 
Sounds ... complicated.
 
Click: Selects item and does nothing else.
Double-click: Selects item and displays in read-only View mode
Right-click: Selects item and displays menu for Viewing, Editing, Deletion, etc.
 
 
Is read-only View mode still a thing? I can't think of any software I currently use (PC, tablet, or phone) that uses View/Edit modes.
 
 
Suggestion:
Click: Select item and display contents in editing mode.
Right-click: Selects item and displays popup menu (Edit, Delete, etc).
Delete key: Delete the selected item.
 
 
If View mode must be included then:
Click: View.
Double-click: Edit
Right-click: Popup menu.
Delete key: Delete the selected item.
 
 
 
 
 
Keep in mind that this is a networked product that can be used in large systems. Opening things for editing just because you clicked on it isn't really a good thing. Opening some things can kick off lots of activity. Making unintended changes is also not a good thing. And it means that you can't even just click on something to rename it (it supports in-place renaming in the browser) without opening it and then having to re-close it again. So I just don't think that opening for any mode just because you selected it is a good thing.
 
Actually, now that I think about it, I've never used a program that opens something just because you select it in the browser/navigator type list. Everything I use requires positive intent to open something by double clicking it or selecting an edit/open command in some way. Probably also because they support in-place editing which requires you click on something to rename it.
 
It's been a dog's age since I fired up Visual Studio but I seem to recall a click, double-click at most, on an item in Solution Explorer will display its contents in editing mode. Large source files pulled from networked servers and loaded into the editing pane in no time at all.
 
Accidental data-entry is handled by either Undo or an explicit Save operation ("Exit without saving changes?" Yes, please!)
 
Not that it's going to change your mind but Premise Builder provided this low-friction interface ten years ago. Click item and contents open in editing mode. Double-click it to rename it. I and others have used it for years and accidental data-entry isn't an issue. I know you're going to say it's different for CQC because it's a networked product. I'll put my old Product Management hat on and say, the consumer doesn't see past the UI. Avoid increasing UI friction to compensate for backend complexities. There has to be a huge foreground performance penalty (i.e. enough to irritate the user) before the backend is allowed to dictate how the front-end functions.
 
At any rate, the new UI is head and shoulders above the current super-modal UI and that's a good thing. Keep up the good work!
 
Well, in this case, the issue is that click to select and click again to rename in-place is the OS standard way to deal with rename (or any in-place editing), and I'm sticking as much as possible to the standard way of doing things, since doing otherwise is one of the primary points of complaint about the current product.
 
So, on that front, wrt to what the single click does, that's nothing to do with CQC or my preferences or anything. It's just the way everything in Windows works so I'm following that standard (and with hot keys and such as well.) I don't want anyone to be able to claim that it's not fully compliant with the standard Windows UI way of doing things.
 
I have no particular opinion on how edit vs. view gets invoked. But, I definitely want to stick to separate edit vs. view, because at some point in the future the back end will probably move towards a completely enterprise type of scheme where you check stuff out to make changes, and versioning is implemented. So you don't want to casually open things for edit mode, because it involves a check out and locks others out of it (for editing), whereas view mode doesn't have those issues. One person has edit rights and everyone else has viewing rights.
 
FWIW, open Windows File Explorer and try to rename a folder using one of the "Windows UI standard" techniques you described. I just confirmed in Windows 8.1 that neither a click-pause-click-again or a double-click allow you to rename a folder. Only F2 or right-click-Rename are available.
 
Garmin Basecamp renames items using F2, click-pause-click-again and a right-click menu. Faststone Image Viewer and Google Earth only allow renaming folders via the right-click menu.
 
Click-pause-click-again and F2 work in Premise Builder. We're not that far apart on agreeing on how it ought to behave. ;)
 
 
I don't know your target market for the revised version of the Admin interface. If it's for Joe Consumer then defaulting to View mode to accommodate a feature only used/seen by John Enterprise is not in Joe's interest. Food for thought: the Admin interface detects if versioning is activated and alters its default behavior. Instead of defaulting to editing (Joe Consumer style) it defaults to viewing (John Enterprise style). The UI transparently adapts to the environment.
 
I currently support all three mechanisms for rename as well. F2, popup menu via right click, or click pause click. Not sure about Windows 8.1, though it wasn't well liked so I'm not sure whether emulating it is very good. I have Windows 10 on a Surface but I don't remember what it does, I'll have to check it. Though, it probably also does different things based on whether it's in tablet mode or laptop mode. For our admin tools, it would only really be used in the laptop mode.
 
Are we talking about the same thing?
 
For File Explorer, click-pause-click-again works for folders listed in the content pane (Win 8.1 and 10). I'm running stock Win 10 Pro (Desktop mode) and treeview folders do not respond to click-pause-click-again for renaming.
 
Or do have an option set somewhere that makes that happen?
 
 
Man this is getting off-topic! Point was to show "Windows Standards" for renaming are not universally applied within Windows OS or Windows programs.
 
Actually I guess the explorer isn't really a good example either way, since it's not really the same sort of thing. It's just browsing files so it shows you the list on the right. It's not an editing tool where the browsing is all done on the left and editing is is done on the right. Selecting something on the left isn't 'opening' anything, it's just browsing still. But, having said that, actual editing still requires some sort of active action, and often there is a distinction between editing and viewing, with editing requiring a popup and selection for 'open with', whereas the default is to open it for viewing (if both actions are available for that type of file.)
 
Anyhoo, in-place edit is going to be used throughout the new interface, so click-pause-click will definitely be a common theme in all those places. Ultimately, if the argument is that there are no standards, then I guess the important thing would be to pick something and be consistent though-out. That I will definitely do. I'll consider making double click the edit mode invocation.
 
BTW, our October sale started today, in case anyone is interested.
 
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