Z-Wave and Think Essentials Issues

[Deane Johnson]

I use Z-Wave with Elve, a VRCOP interface, and Think Essentials and a Think Stick.
 
It's been running along great, but I haven't kept up to date on what is going on with Leviton.  I am also running Think Essentials on a laptop to program the modules.
 
With Think Essentials running on my PC/Windows 8.1, I get a message that it needs to shut down.  It doesn't shut down and I can do some things with it still.
 
My question is where are we now on tools to manage a Z-Wave network.  I probably need to get up to date.   I don't see any upgrade indication for Think Essentials or the Think Stick.  What should I be using now to be up to date and stable?
 
Thanks
 
Deane Johnson

 

[drvnbysound]

I've been using the VRUSB-1US for quite some time. It's the Leviton primary controller, whereas the VRC0P is the secondary controller.

 

[Deane Johnson]

I'm assuming the VRUSB-1US and associated software is the updated replacement for Think Essentials?
 
I've read some comments that some of the Leviton primary controllers don't play well with non-Leviton products.  It's hard to know if that's factual, or just an issue someone is having with cheap components.

 

[xlurkr]

You can run the free Leviton RF Installer Tool software with the Thinkstick, if you have the right firmware.  See this post:
 
http://forum.micasaverde.com/index.php/topic,11014.msg78325.html#msg78325
 
I have verified that it works.  I'd guess that it interoperates with the VRC0P well, and it is occasionally updated, though usually with a few new bugs each time.
 
-Tom

 

[drvnbysound]

I only used the primary controller to do the network setup. Once that was complete, I updated my secondary controller (VRC0P) and connected it to my Elk (via XSLZW). Other than management/enrollment, I do not use the primary controller.

 

[xlurkr]

That's how all of these work: as primary controllers for enrolling devices and setting up the network.
 
The software versions require that you walk around with your laptop.  They have the advantage of GUIs, ease of renaming devices and collecting them into rooms, files you can reuse if you do many identical installations, diagnostic tools, etc.
 
The remote you have is easy to carry and doubles as a remote.  There are a few other remotes that operate similarly, I think.  I have some GE ones that can set up a network, but I wouldn't call them full featured.
 
I don't have Leviton devices in my network, but if you do, you need to make sure you have an easy way to set up and maintain associations.  The RF Installer Tool probably excels here.
 
The Vera is so cheap now that I'd argue it makes a decent installer tool, if you can conquer the significant learning curve.
 
-Tom

 

[ddennerline]

Development for ThinkEssentials has stopped, but as you suggested the product is still useful if you are using a non-Elk integration solution such as CQC or Elve.
 
The ThinkStick Pro does not support the Security/Beaming classes for lock support.
If you are happy with current TE primary controller, I would recommend you not change over the RFIT because RFIT has a whole different set of defects and issues.
 
Until the most recent 1.1.3.0 version, the software consistently crashed. I am as of today still trying to convince Leviton to fix the unstable VRC0P+3 Virtual Button (association) over-the-air synchronization feature.  I am getting tired of carry laptop and rebuilding network whenever routing issue comes up. I spent two days this month trying to exclude / include a lock that had somehow lost it communication with network.
 
You could stick with a Windows Vista 32 labtop and TE. You could even dual boot between Windows 8 and Vista.
 
If you decided to switch to RFIT, you must exclude all Z-Wave devices using TE first. If you perform this function, then you will have to factory reset on all devices. This will require reading lots of documentation because switches and scene controllers have different magic buttons.

 

[ddennerline]

The RFIT supports a good number of Locks. I have two Z-Wave Kwikset locks. I have enrolled Evolve LOM-16 receptacle. I tried a few years ago to enroll a Z-Wave Thermostat , but it failed.
In the RFIT documentation, I could not find an official list of third-party devices that are supported.

 

[Deane Johnson]

Well, I downloaded the new Leviton Installer Tool software to see what it looked like.  I promptly did something to cause it to wipe my Thinkstick clean.  Since it appears I'll be starting over, I decided that meant I should get a VRUSB-1US so I ordered one overnighted from Amazon.
 
Meantime, my ZWave network still operates normally with Elve and the VRCOP interface.  I'm hoping the new setup will recognize the existing network and import it.
 
Thanks for all of the posts and suggestions.

 

[Dean Roddey]

You may not be able to do that. The 'suppository of all knowledge' is the primary controller. I'm not sure if the VRCOP has a mode to replicate the other way back to the primary. I think it only allows replication from the primary to it, since it's a secondary controller. Also, it won't be part of the new network (which is also defined by the primary) so you'll have to add it to the new primary controller, and that may reset it as well. That may actually have something to do with why the USB stick got whacked, because the real primary in the Leviton world is the software, and the stick is sort of just it's on-ramp to the network. So, given that there was no existing Leviton defined network, it may have just reset the USB stick.

 

[xlurkr]

Deane:
 
I feel horrible!  I have both Think Essentials and RFIT working with the same Think Stick right now, and the same Z-Wave network is displayed and controllable by either.  I can go back and forth between the programs at will with no side effects.  But I don't honestly remember if running RFIT for the first time reset the stick.  It might have, because I was just bench testing everything with a small # of devices at the time, so I wouldn't have viewed it as an big deal.  I'm really sorry if my advice hurt you.
 
Dean may be right.  Some combinations of controllers allow "controller shift", where a primary and secondary exchange roles, but  if you delete the primary rather than reassign it there may be no way to recover other than starting over with a new primary.
 
-Tom

 

[ddennerline]

TE USB Stick is not officially supported by RFIT. As xlurkr suggested, you can update the TE Z-Wave firmware to 4.3/5.3 latest TE firmware, and RFIT will not produce any warnings.
 
Once you receive your VRUSB, you can use the "Recover Network" menu option as a first attempt to avoid rebuilding entire network. If that fails, you will have to factory reset every device.
 
It might be possible to use TE and use the “Configure Stick to Match File” option. This option reprograms the USB stick using the original file as master.

 

[Deane Johnson]

Deane:
 
I feel horrible!  I have both Think Essentials and RFIT working with the same Think Stick right now, and the same Z-Wave network is displayed and controllable by either.  I can go back and forth between the programs at will with no side effects.  But I don't honestly remember if running RFIT for the first time reset the stick.  It might have, because I was just bench testing everything with a small # of devices at the time, so I wouldn't have viewed it as an big deal.  I'm really sorry if my advice hurt you.
 
Dean may be right.  Some combinations of controllers allow "controller shift", where a primary and secondary exchange roles, but  if you delete the primary rather than reassign it there may be no way to recover other than starting over with a new primary.
 
-Tom

Tom:
 
Do not feel horrible.  Not even a little bit.  It was my hacking around that caused the issue, not your advice in any way.  The good news is that I don't have a very large ZWave network and it's good that I am updating it to current components.
 
The biggest effort I will face is that the nodes will now have new numbers so I'll have to carefully go through Elve and reassign them.
 
Deane
 
EDIT:  I'm wondering about the process of starting a new network.  Right now my existing network is fully functional with all devices performing as they should.  When I enroll them in a new network, is their inclusion in the old network automatically canceled.  I assume they can't be in two networks at once.

 

[Dean Roddey]

If the old network is going to remain around you should remove them, so that the old master controller isn't trying to talk to things that it can't find anymore. But if you are just starting over, just including them into the new network (which will be the only one) should be fine. I think that, long ago, there were some issues with some units if you didn't first remove them from the current network before adding them to a new one, but I don't think that's the case anymore. It was completely impractical because, if you lost or broke your master controller (they were all remote controls back then), and you had a unit that could be included into a new network before removing from the old, it was effectively a dead unit.

 

[Deane Johnson]

Dean:
 
Thanks for the response.
 
I think the old network is dead and will be unnecessary unless the new controller will happen to retrieve it.  In that unlikely case, I'll just stick with the old network.
 
I spent last evening watching how-to videos on your site.  Nicely done.  I wish I had enough memory left (mental) to learn CQC.  It sure looks interesting.
 
Deane