ELK M1 Intermittent False Alarm

[BraveSirRobbin]

The gaps appear to be in the normal range and shows the windows need to be open a ways before they show trip.
 
The closed closed readings are higher than the other sensors, but by such a small amount that I would not worry about that.  It may be worthwhile ensuring the wiring from the plug in transformer and the wires to the battery are secured (nothing loose, very lightly tug on them).
 
Other than that, I'm pretty much out of ideas.
 
Oh, one other thing...you are not using EOL resistors, do you have that proper setting in each zone (no EOL's installed)?  I can't remember where that is at in the Elk RP software but its somewhere in the sensor type.

 

[flbbon4123]

BraveSirRobbin,
Really appreciate all your time and effort.
I will double check the wiring at the transformer and battery as you suggest.
 
All zones are set as "1=Normally Closed".
 
One last question:
I have the resistors that I can install. What benefit might that provide to the system?

 

[BraveSirRobbin]

The EOL resistors benefits for a residential installation are up for debate here on this forum.  If they are truly installed at the very end at the sensor itself, they can offer some real time monitoring of cabling issues if one were to drive a nail in the cabling, or if there was an open, or someone was trying to bypass the sensor. 
 
I authored THS post better explaining these scenarios.  Sandpiper also offered THIS thread as well.
 
Personally, I did not use EOL resistors in my or any of my friend's Elk installations in the past.  Again, this is my opinion and Spanky, Elk's Chief Engineer agreed with me at the time, you get better noise immunity as the voltage spread between open and closed is greater not using EOLs.  Again, not to spark a Ford vs Chevy type of debate here, this is just MY opinion and others will disagree here.
 
I am hoping someone with more recent Elk experience (mine is very dated) can chime in here and maybe even show a screen grab of the EOL defeat setting when setting a zone up in Elk RP (again, hope I'm remembering this correctly and not reverting back to my Caddx days).

 

[flbbon4123]

BraveSirRobbin,
Just wanted to give you a huge shoutout for all the help, guidance and suggestions you have provided. It is really appreciated.
 
I have a much better understanding of the system and troubleshooting methodology.
 
All the best and stay safe!!

 

[flbbon4123]

RAL and upstatemike,
 
Thanks for all your input and suggestions and taking the time to offer me some possibilities for my problem.
 
Other than realigning one of the magnets, replacing the CR2032 battery, I haven't made any changes to the system.
 
I have not had any alarms in 5 days so I am hoping this 'bug' has died!!
 
Thanks again and all the best!!
Stay safe

 

[flbbon4123]

Final update.
After changing the CR2032 battery I have not had any false alarms in over 3 weeks.
My assumption at this point is the battery being weak "May" have been the culprit. But I don't have definitive proof.
 
Marking this thread as resolved.

 

[flbbon4123]

I had another false alarm at 8:30 PM EDT yesterday.
This is the first false alarm since March 12th and there haven't been any changes to the system.
 
As RAL stated in a previous post, changing the CR2032 does not appear to have resolved the problem.
 
QUESTIONS:
1) If there is a problem with the main board, is there any way to do a diagnostic on the board?
2) Could spiders or other bugs cause a false alarm? - I know spiders have caused false alarms on smoke detectors so just trying to think outside the box.
 
Thanks

 

[BraveSirRobbin]

Honestly, at this stage desperate troubleshooting is needed.  I suggest just removing the sensor wiring at the panel and shorting those two terminals together, thus eliminating everything external to the panel including wiring and the sensor itself.
 
Of course you leave that zone vulnerable, but I don't know what else to do and this way at least you would know if the problem is in the panel itself or not...of course this may take a few months to determine this based on your past false alarm pattern/history.

 

[flbbon4123]

Okay and thanks again.
 
I have seen violations on 3 zones.
I plan on removing the sensor wires from the panel for all 3 zones and then waiting to see what happens.
 
Given I don't know what is triggering the false alarm, don't know for sure what time frame this will occur in, etc., I am really flying blind.
 
Is there any kind of stress test or routine that can be run to identify any panel issues?

 

[heffneil]

I realize this is old. I have 5 doors and I wired 4 doors and the 5th at the end is a slider with a GRI door sensor that has the built-in resistor. it's been flapping at odd times. I was convinced the issue was the gap between the slider and the sensor. I tested it with magnets and it closed. So I added a stronger magnet to the door, and it continued to flap. The other 4 doors aren't moving or being blown or anything. I see voltages go from 7.9 to 12.0. Not sure exactly whats going on - no rhyme or reason. I did reconnect the zone to the panel to make sure it was secure. Any other suggestions are appreciated!

 

[BraveSirRobbin]

If this were me, I would get a good set of mini grabber clips (these from Pomona seem like a good quality), then disconnect the two zone leads going to the Elk and measure resistance. Have someone open and close all of the doors (wiggle them a little as well) and see if you have any fluctuations. This should also tell you the value of the GRI door sensor's EOL resistor.

Make sure no fingers are touching the leads as this can influence resistance readings. Also ensure the lead ends are sitting on a non-conductive surface, or better yet, hanging in the air during the readings.

I'm assuming the five doors are wired in series going to one zone input on the Elk (after reading your post).

Do you have EOL option enabled on this zone?

 

[Sandpiper]

I had a sensor that would trip because of heat from the sun. (Of course it took me quite a few months to figure this out). I replaced the sensor several times with a new one, but over time it would happen again; always tripping about 2 PM in the afternoon. So I changed the type of sensor and moved it so the sun could not affect it. Problem solved. It has never falsely tripped again for several years now.

I suppose that cold could affect sensors as well.

 

[ano]

All modern alarms have a cross-zoning alarm feature. Turn it on and us it for all motion sensors in your house. Basically its a false alarm prevention feature where if only one motion detector falses, the alarm does not go off. Rather, two or more sensors are required to activate within a set time, say 2 minutes. Many areas require the use of this feature for monitored alarms. If someone breaks in, don't worry, I can guarantee at least two motion sensors will trip, if not also door/window sensors, glass breakage, etc. If only one motion goes off, you should see it in the logs.