Help with demo system for WAF

[jdk972003]

All right, I finally heard those magic words..."Honey, I think I would like to feel safer when we go to bed...what does it take to do that light and security stuff?"

Translated for you guys...this means in the big picture she wants to feel more secure and turn off any lights in the house without getting out of bed. From other conversations, knowing the garage is closed would be a big plus. And she wants to be able to identify (post robbing) any would be robbers that approach or enter the house to “put their a** in jail”. Finally, she would like control from the bedside. I have shown her several examples (keypads, phones, tablets, in-wall, etc) and she likes the idea of a few ipads distributed through the house which do everything.

I have been reading up on HA for over a year in preparation for her asking. So I am familiar with the topics and most of the possibilities. My end goal would be to have our permanent house with Security/Cameras, UPB and/or Z-wave, whole house audio, being controlled from multiple ipad/phones with a home layout approach to interface. Similar to the Homeseer HSTouch or CQC examples I have seen with floor plans.

A couple “catches”. The big one, she wants to do a “test run” in just the master, i.e. lights, one camera, maybe one alarm sensor, etc. Basically we are going to treat the master like a house for demo purposes. To this end, I need to develop a budget we can agree on for the test run. If she likes what she see’s in the test run, I will be authorized to extend to full house. The other caveat is we are renting while we shop for houses, so anything I do for test run is temporary and I need to be able to remove it without permanent impact.

I can grab a couple UPB switches etc easily enough, but knowing I need to sell this reverse of how I need to install it I am stuck on what’s a cheap path to start (i.e. I need the floorplan interface to be great, easy, and attractive…and just work even if it controls only a single switch!)

And of course, I need to minimize the initial budget for the test run so she continues to support it, and I can get her hooked for a full budget! (Why do I suddenly feel like a dealer? B) ) That most software out of reach for the test run.

What would be a good start and budget? I have a server in the basement and wireless N in the house. I am very handy so no issues installing anything. Great with software and hardware but I am not much of a programmer.

So what do you guys think?

 

[Paul]

Shotgun propped against the nightstand?

 

[Deane Johnson]

Bal, it isn't easy to be half pregnant, which is what I would equate a test run to.

When I started into HA, my wife sort of looked at it as another one of my ventures into spending unnecessary money. Now, she's the one pushing for expansion.

Your goals, and hers, are good. But some of the things you need for a test run, you need for the real thing. That being control capabilities, software, etc. I can see this going down in flames trying to do a convincing demonstration with minimal equipment. Just my opinion, others on here who are smarter than I may give you different advice.

On the issue of software costs, I hear you. I had the same issue, wanted something robust but with a simple learning curve, and highly reliable. There are multiple good pieces of software on the market, but they either don't meet the simple learning curve, or meet the reasonable cost factor, or something. I lived with this frustration until Elve hit the market. After a free download (typical of all software), the introductory price is only $99. Even my wife smiled at that.

If you want to look at it and compare with others here's the link. I have no connection with Elve whatsoever, I paid my $99 just like everyone else.

http://codecoretechnologies.com/content/MainPage.ashx

You came to the right forum for discussion of your project. There are some great contributors on here, and they treat people with respect.

Deane

 

[jwilson56]

Elve is a good choice to start with as it has simulated drivers to play with. I currently use Netremote/Girder 5 but will be migrating to Elve as it matures.

Take a look at my showcase blog here on CT to get some ideas. Personally I use Elk for security and automation but my wife loves the whole house music system I have (six independent zones)

 

[jdk972003]

I was afraid of that. There is a minimum cost floor which you have to get to have it work.

I will check out the Elve as a possability.

So for now..I am looking at the following

System Software (Elve?)
iPad app/software
2 zwave window sensors
1 wireless web camera
UPB switches / plugs

Any other ideas / approaches?

 

[tmbrown97]

I found an easier method for me was to tell her roughly what the first order cost - then just not mention the next 3 orders of stuff... i'm pretty sure she still thinks our whole Elk only cost about $800

Then with lighting, I complained about hte lights being too bright all the time - really wanting to dim them - then I showed the cost of a leviton dimmer vs. Simply Automated - and made the connection about convenience and safety.

Last - tied in the safety/security... with an alarm she can also know when the 2yr old wanders outside when she's not supposed to!

Now it's a requirement.

 

[johnny]

Barring any budget issues, i think it may be wise to start with an automation capable security system since your wife is looking for the feeling of security when going to bed. Perhaps you can skip the demo and go straight to a minimal installation for a security system. Unfortunately you are looking at a initial cost of like $650 and higher for the Elk M1. If you are planning to move any time soon, you can get the wireless receiver and install wireless window/door sensors.

From there you can add a computer interface running Elve, Homeseer, CQC...
And add lighting via X10, insteon, Zwave, UPB and so forth.

For me, it was easy to get the security system pass the marital budget committee. I held out until i found a used demo elk system for under $300 so i could have home automation capabilities later on.

 

[Neurorad]

I agree, shoot for whole-house security out of the gate. Tie in some lights after it's up and running, don't buy any dimmers until you're ready; technology changes quickly, might be something better in 6 months.

 

[tmbrown97]

I'll second that... if you start with the Elk M1 security/automation panel, you can get in pretty cheap and add parts on later after they've proven themselves. I started with security, then added tstat and some lighting (5 switches)... then when I moved I went all-out with the lighting (60 switches) since the system was now proven and known - now it's just a matter of adapting to the new house.

eKeypad for the iphone is awesome and the basic version is now free - and you can buy upgrades as you add more features like lighting - it'll control the elk easily.

I would avoid the z-wave contact sensors and go with the GE ones and the wireless interface for the M1.

For cameras - is this for exterior view? I ask because it's generally still frowned upon to use wireless cameras indoors - just doesn't feel secure enough yet for most - and having your video intercepted so people can see inside your house is creepy and dangerous.

Check out my signature for a wealth of info on UPB switches from Simply Automated...

 

[Deane Johnson]

Before you got with UPB, make sure you have a neutral wire available. I started to use UPB and discovered the white wire in my switch box was nothing more than a loop down of the hot side from the fixture. I had to return the dimmers and go with Z-Wave which doesn't require a neutral.

There are ways to overcome the neutral issue with UPB, but I didn't want to pull wires and try to fit a module into the fixture outlet. I just wanted to install a dimmer switch and be ready to go.

 

[Monk]

I started to use UPB and discovered the white wire in my switch box was nothing more than a loop down of the hot side from the fixture. I had to return the dimmers and go with Z-Wave which doesn't require a neutral.

Careful - Some Zwave requires neutral.

 

[jwilson56]

I would stick with an Elk M1XRF2G Wireless Receiver and the NX-650 sensors for the best results. You can use the internal contacts or use external ones with the NX-650. I use them for my house and have never had a single fault trigger with them.

 

[Neurorad]

"Basic security is a necessity," you tell your wife.

Buy a respectable, affordable alarm panel that offers some HA capabilities as well, e.g. Elk. No demo necessary.

Go for the demo after you have the Elk installed.

 

[raptor_demon]

Hi,

If i were you i would goto www.radioshack.com and search for z-wave and pick up some of hte really cheap modules they have on sale right now. Most of the stuff is up to 80% off but very limited supply. Most modules range from 9.89 to 14.99 inc advanced remotes.

Then i would grab a usb z-wave stick for about 40-100usd:


I have this one:
http://www.smarthome...-interface.aspx

then i would install the trial of homeseer pro on your server which you can test for 30 days.

Someone in the homeseer forums is stlling s wifi camrea for 50usd also.


You could use x10 ds10a's for door and window sensors which can sometime sbe found for 19.99usd for 4-6. and get yourself a x10 RF reciever to read them such as the w800:
http://store.homesee...WGL-P24C45.aspx

for about 100-150usd you can do a 30 day trial without the x10 stuff or about 200usd with it.


PM me if you would like to talk about this, i am always under a budget.

Raptor

 

[pete_c]

The WAF thing is interesting. Historically my wife has always been in a somewhat HA environment.

Initially in the 80's it was just TTS tied into the security system. She was aware of it but kind of ignored it a bit. Not too long ago though she saw a syndicated television show that highlighted TTS and for whatever reason seemed to notice the TTS in the house for the first time and in a new light.

She (wife) has really never interacted or even touched the touchscreens for whatever reason. She went to visit a friend of her's about 2 months ago whom sold her old home and purchased a new home from a contractor at a "good" deal. I guess in some conversation her friend told her that the contractor put in about 250K in HA into the house (touchscreens etc). All of a sudden (last month or so) she's asking and using the touchscreens.

I don't understand the logic.

As above mentioned I would also recommend maybe starting with an HA style security system; maybe automating lights first. Two mentioned here are the HAI and Elk systems. Both are very nice products. I have a HAI OPII installed in two homes. I have not had any issues. I also utilize Homeseer and its been installed since the late 1990's. Relating to lighting technology; I started with X-10 in the late 1970's. It worked fine for me until I decided to upgrade technologies in the 2000's. I still am on the fence a bit and now utilizing X-10, Insteon, UPB and Z-Wave. I have been replacing my in wall switches though with just UPB and about 50% of my external switches with Z-Wave.

The forum here, documentation and users provide an abundance of information for whatever you decide to do. Great bunch of folks here!