M1 and DSC FS-410 Smokes

[RandyKnight]

I'm trying to bench test my smokes before installation and don't have something connected and/or configured right. The smoke is a DSC FS-410. It has 5 screw contacts on it. From the diagram it looks like the 5th one is to daisy chain the power. I've got the Pos/Neg SAUX from the M1 connected to the Pos/Neg terminals on the smoke and show 13.8V there. The other 2 screws are labeled NO and COM. They are connected to the M1 Zone 1 and it's negative. I've tried switching those but still get "fire trouble" when I power up the Elk. I also see nothing on the LED on the smoke.

Any help would be appreciated.

 

[WayneW]

I think you need a resistor in there.

 

[pjpete]

Just as an fyi I bought 8 of these smokes before Christmas and they ended up being part of a recall. I can't recall the actual dates, but I think it involved dates within November/December 2006.

Pete

 

[Digger]

Only Zn16 needs the 820 ohm EOL (if its set for 2 wire smoke). 4 wire smokes on any zone would need the 2.2K EOL.

Virtually any 12 Vdc 4 wire smoke will work on the M1. Only certian 2 wire smoke detectors have been documented as compatible with the M1 on Zn16.

 

[rfdesq]

Digger is right, my previous post was wrong. I have deleted it so as not to confuse. Thanks.

 

[RandyKnight]

Only Zn16 needs the 820 ohm EOL (if its set for 2 wire smoke). 4 wire smokes on any zone would need the 2.2K EOL.

Virtually any 12 Vdc 4 wire smoke will work on the M1. Only certian 2 wire smoke detectors have been documented as compatible with the M1 on Zn16.

So consider this post a request for "smokes for dummies". How do I wire the smoke to the M1? Where doest he resistor go and what terminal from the M1 goes to what terminal on the smoke?

 

[WayneW]

The 2200 ohm resistor goes across the smoke detector NO and COM terminals (in parallel with the detector). When the smoke detector smells smoke, it closes the NO (normally open) outputs which effectively shorts out the resistor giving the panel nearly zero resistance triggering an alarm. Without the resistor, the panel sees the circuit as infinite resistance (an open) which is considered a trouble situation.

zero ohms = alarm
2200 ohms = normal
infinite ohms = trouble

The Elk M1 manual has a diagram on page 4.

If you add a second detector to the same zone, it just goes across the zone wires (and needs power). Don't add another resistor. Any detector can short the resistor and take the zone resistance to zero ohms to trigger an alarm.

Don't put the resistor in the panel. Technically it will work, but it gives you no monitoring of the zone wires. Doors & windows are usually a NC (normally closed) circuit so they are fairly self monitoring, even without an EOL resistor. (I consider a break in the zone wiring much more likely than a short circuit, unless you have people messing with things).

 

[Digger]

With 4 wire smokes you really should have an EOL Relay with a EOL Resistor. This way your power to the smoke(s) is also supervised.

It will work without it but you would not know if you lost your smoke power (SVAUX).

 

[ctwilliams]

I did the exact same thing, I did not put the resistor in and got the trouble indication. There is a small diagram in this thread where I had asked for help that may help you if there is not one with your detector...

Four wire thread

 

[RandyKnight]

With 4 wire smokes you really should have an EOL Relay with a EOL Resistor. This way your power to the smoke(s) is also supervised.

It will work without it but you would not know if you lost your smoke power (SVAUX).

Is the EOL Relay an Elk part? If so, what part #?

 

[RandyKnight]

With 4 wire smokes you really should have an EOL Relay with a EOL Resistor. This way your power to the smoke(s) is also supervised.

It will work without it but you would not know if you lost your smoke power (SVAUX).

Is the EOL Relay an Elk part? If so, what part #?

 

[Digger]

No ELK does not make one. I use a Napco FT-2200R which has a built in 2.2K resistor. There are several others out there. They go for about $15 a piece (plus or minus a little depending on what brand and where you buy them.

You can get started now without the relay and add it later. Just dont forget it.

 

[RandyKnight]

The resistor did it. And of course now that I look its plain as day on the Elk diagram. My bad. I have somewhat of an excuse though as I've installed over 100 Insteon switches over the past few days. Got those all working and now its on to the Elk for a targeted move-in date of 3/3. Want to get the Elk installed with at least smokes working before we move in.