Need whole house audio recommendations

[86turbodsl]

Multizone audio is not all that difficult, as long as you don't make it so....
Products like MainLobby / MusicLobby enable multizone audio in literally an hour or so (not including the hardware installation).

Not sure if there is a Linux based strong alternative that keeps it as simple.

Yeah, it'd be easy to do in Windows I suppose, but I refuse to play that update / virus protect / licensing / patches BS that M$ inflicts on everyone in the free world whenever it can
in the interest of dumbing down the os to where little kids can use it. I tolerate XP on the kids computer just so they can do the nickjr.com thing, but everything else runs linux for
stability. My main linux mail server has been running non-stop for over 5 years with nearly zero maintenance. Now that's uptime....

I guess the hardware won't be too tough, but the software for this might get tricky?

 

[jwilson56]

A setup like my Now Playing 2008 would be under 2K. I have 6 independant zones with 200W per zone RMS and each zone has its own FM tuner as well as being able to play its own playlist/CD from a 800 disk library of lossless material. All tucked into a central location and controlled via touch screens using Net Remote and my own skin.

Have you checked out my showcase?

John

http://www.cocoontech.com/index.php?showtopic=2444

I have looked at your setup a bit. The trouble with touchscreens everywhere is you usually need a computer to run them, and
I've recently become aware of the amount of electricity I'm consuming with 4 pc's running 24/7 in the house right now.

A bit off topic, but my total HA setup will be as follows:

High end linux server in basement running:
Mythtv backend
Asterix backend
Home automation duty - maybe housebot in a wine shell

Lighting is centralite
Security is Elk M1

Each TV location gets a small diskless PC that can be shut off easily

The whole house audio is ??

The only two computers I want in the house to run 24/7 are the linux server and the firewall box.

All media gets stored on the server. Any system like JWilson's would need to be supplied on audio cards in the server.
I'm not sure if the motherboard I pick for the server will have lots of PCI slots to use.

I may be able to get the zones down to 5, but not 4. So I think I'm stuck with two sound cards minimum.

I like the idea of your setup Jwilson, but don't know if i like the idea of having a remote in each zone to control the stereo.
The thought was that I have a touchscreen upstairs and a touchscreen downstairs to set the music going, and then use
volume controls in each zone to turn volume / on / off.

I'm starting to see that multizoned multisourced audio gets very complicated very quickly....

Well if you use volume controls in each zone how do you browse and select which songs to play? I really don't think you have thought this out much. Like DavidL said there are not many Linux solutions out there and fewer true multizones that allow you to play distinct tracks in each zone. My setup evolved over a few years to where its at now.

 

[86turbodsl]

Well if you use volume controls in each zone how do you browse and select which songs to play? I really don't think you have thought this out much. Like DavidL said there are not many Linux solutions out there and fewer true multizones that allow you to play distinct tracks in each zone. My setup evolved over a few years to where its at now.

Well now that's why I'm here asking you guys!

You are right, I do need somewhere to select the songs. My original thought was a single touchscreen for each floor to select
which tracks play in each zone, rather than a touchscreen in each zone, but it might make more sense to eventually get to
one each zone. If I do that, then there's no reason I can't go with your setup with discrete recievers for each zone and a dumb
lpad or whatever to control volume locally.

My ideas have evolved over the day to maybe a single pc in the media closet with two Maudio 410 cards serving 8 zones, and touchscreens all connected multiheaded to the same pc. That gets me out of lots of pc's all over the house to maintain. Newer versions of Xorg allow multiseat
X sessions allowing discrete displays for each screen acting as a separate computer. The only thing remaining is the control bits running in linux, and it's not that hard to use a wine or VMware session to emulate windows and use a WinOS based program such as Girder.

 

[DavidL]

running a windows app on Win over Linux is not such a great idea. more links in the chain to break, more to manage, more to know.

When you are using Windows as a controller, you don't rely on microsoft patches because it is not being used to surf the Internet.

You can build it on XPEmbedded if you are looking for that next level of simplicity /efficiency (if you know how to build XPe and have licenses).

Keep it simple

 

[royalj7]

My ideas have evolved over the day to maybe a single pc in the media closet with two Maudio 410 cards serving 8 zones, and touchscreens all connected multiheaded to the same pc. That gets me out of lots of pc's all over the house to maintain. Newer versions of Xorg allow multiseat
X sessions allowing discrete displays for each screen acting as a separate computer. The only thing remaining is the control bits running in linux, and it's not that hard to use a wine or VMware session to emulate windows and use a WinOS based program such as Girder.

Just remember if you go this way you will need seperate amps in each zone to power your speakers. If you can find some cheap ones and have a place to put them out of the way (or stacking them all in one wiring closet/headend), this is a pretty good solution.

 

[RobWalker]

Going DIY is definitely possible, but in my experience the cost savings never pan out to what you think they will be. Ideally you would want the same amp per zone otherwise any kind of control becomes really complex. As mentioned earlier having a lot of separate amps will also impact power consumption ... saving a couple of hundred $ but adding $5 \ month to your hydro bill may not make sense (though those numbers were totally made up!)

I've been looking for an M-Audio 410 card for a while now -- the supply seems to have really dried up, even on ebay. You will probably find you need to go with a 1010LT which is more expensive and has one less output (if I'm remembering right).

The control issue is tricky (unless you have an unlimited budget!) -- what other HA/HT functions would you want the screens to control? I went with Windows Home Server on my main backend box since (a) I know how to administer it and P there just wasn't a decent Linux solution. For zone control I am wondering about using iPod touches for around $300 \ zone, there is still a lack of software today but I think that will change fairly quickly. Nokia n800's are fairly cheap if you can still find them and offer a full Linux environment to play with.

Being able to run multiple X sessions off a single box with multiple display cards is an attractive option. Wouldn't this require support from the touch screen driver as well? If the Elo drivers supported this then you could look at adding touch screen for <$150 \ zone (+ a fraction of the computer you are connecting to + the cost of CAT5 baluns to extend the VGA to the remote locations + ...)

 

[jwilson56]

Going DIY is definitely possible, but in my experience the cost savings never pan out to what you think they will be. Ideally you would want the same amp per zone otherwise any kind of control becomes really complex. As mentioned earlier having a lot of separate amps will also impact power consumption ... saving a couple of hundred $ but adding $5 \ month to your hydro bill may not make sense (though those numbers were totally made up!)

I've been looking for an M-Audio 410 card for a while now -- the supply seems to have really dried up, even on ebay. You will probably find you need to go with a 1010LT which is more expensive and has one less output (if I'm remembering right).

The control issue is tricky (unless you have an unlimited budget!) -- what other HA/HT functions would you want the screens to control? I went with Windows Home Server on my main backend box since (a) I know how to administer it and P there just wasn't a decent Linux solution. For zone control I am wondering about using iPod touches for around $300 \ zone, there is still a lack of software today but I think that will change fairly quickly. Nokia n800's are fairly cheap if you can still find them and offer a full Linux environment to play with.

Being able to run multiple X sessions off a single box with multiple display cards is an attractive option. Wouldn't this require support from the touch screen driver as well? If the Elo drivers supported this then you could look at adding touch screen for <$150 \ zone (+ a fraction of the computer you are connecting to + the cost of CAT5 baluns to extend the VGA to the remote locations + ...)

Actually the way I have my setup it really doesn't matter what brand amp you use in each zone (I use Sony, Technics and Onkyo) and since the amp is controlled by the touchscreen it doesn't draw any power unless your listening to that zone so actually it saves money.

For my sound source I use one Delta 410 card and two Xitel USB devices. That gives me 6 zones. The master zone is from the Xitel HIFI PRO via TOSlink to my Sony ES receiver and also supplies a RCA line level signal that routes through a Xantec distribution amp ($65) and feeds the AUX inputs on the other 5 receivers. This was I can do hardware syncing between any zones so they can be playing the same track with no lag between them. My Technics receivers averaged $50 each off Ebay so it was a cheap way to do it. They are all centrally located with the server that runs JRMC, Netremote and Girder 5 and handles all my automation needs as well as being the database/player for my 800+ ripped CD's using APE lossless format. So I get high quality music with a total of 1540 watts RMS for all six zones. Of coarse I only turn on the zones I need to at the time. I use the Ocelot and a SECU-16IR to control all the receivers.


One nice thing is that you only really need to run speaker wires. No messy LPADS to mount and deal with. I have read many a horror story dealing with LPADS. No IR repeaters, no LPADS and no remotes to keep track of. Just press a button on a Netremote screen and it sends a Girder event out which then sends out the proper IR command to the correct receiver for that zone. Quite easy and very reliable.

For what my Dell 4600 PC draws being on 24/7 I have to say I get quite a lot of functionality from it for home automation, security and whole house music. I don't mind paying for that.

 

[stacyh3]

I use the Advanced Whole House Audio system from Home Theater Direct. The have a basic and mid-level system too. Not too expensive. Very easy to install and operate. It also allows for local inputs from the keypads.

Stacy

 

[personalt]

I use the Advanced Whole House Audio system from Home Theater Direct. The have a basic and mid-level system too. Not too expensive. Very easy to install and operate. It also allows for local inputs from the keypads.

Stacy

I was looking at the advanced system from HTD... However no RS232 control.. so you can only control from the keypads, this elimates future autoamation. I would like at 7:30am the whole house audio to kick in and via test to speach tell me the weather..

They just updated their mid level unit and that has RS232 support.. but doesnt support interfacing to a doorbell which is key to me.

for those who are interested in the RS232 controls for the midlevel system I have it up on divshare. They are advertising whores but after a page or two you can get the download.

http://www.divshare.com/download/4923205-2b5

No to jack this guys thread but is there anything cheaper then then nuvo that will give you play lists and allow you to control the FM tuner from the keypad and allow for RS232 access.

 

[86turbodsl]

Going DIY is definitely possible, but in my experience the cost savings never pan out to what you think they will be. Ideally you would want the same amp per zone otherwise any kind of control becomes really complex. As mentioned earlier having a lot of separate amps will also impact power consumption ... saving a couple of hundred $ but adding $5 \ month to your hydro bill may not make sense (though those numbers were totally made up!)

I've been looking for an M-Audio 410 card for a while now -- the supply seems to have really dried up, even on ebay. You will probably find you need to go with a 1010LT which is more expensive and has one less output (if I'm remembering right).

The control issue is tricky (unless you have an unlimited budget!) -- what other HA/HT functions would you want the screens to control? I went with Windows Home Server on my main backend box since (a) I know how to administer it and P there just wasn't a decent Linux solution. For zone control I am wondering about using iPod touches for around $300 \ zone, there is still a lack of software today but I think that will change fairly quickly. Nokia n800's are fairly cheap if you can still find them and offer a full Linux environment to play with.

Being able to run multiple X sessions off a single box with multiple display cards is an attractive option. Wouldn't this require support from the touch screen driver as well? If the Elo drivers supported this then you could look at adding touch screen for <$150 \ zone (+ a fraction of the computer you are connecting to + the cost of CAT5 baluns to extend the VGA to the remote locations + ...)

It's tough to integrate control on keypads with media servers, so people tend to want to go with ipods or whatever in each zone. I want all the music centralized on the server, so that's out.
I want something mounted to the wall so it won't get lost, so N800's are out. I want it to be large enough to use a finger to run, so N800's are out. Fujitsu 3400/3500 have palm rejection so they
are tough to control. So they are out. I really wanted remote screens instead of remote PC's.
I did some digging last night and found that mythfrontend can run multiple instances on a single pc using multiseat, so I was thinking multiple remote screens on multiseat,
with output on a M-audio card or equivalent, going to discrete amps or maybe awhole house amp. The mythfrontends can just run a mythmusic client so it's just music on the screen. If there's additional functionality I'd want later, I could look at housebot or mainlobby or whatever on certain screens.

The typical touchscreen uses a mouse driver so control isn't an issue.

The supermicro mainboard I'm looking at has 4 pci slots, so I'd have a couple of Matrox G200's quad screened, and two M-audio boards. Gives me 8 zones on a single PC.

 

[86turbodsl]

I've been looking for an M-Audio 410 card for a while now -- the supply seems to have really dried up, even on ebay. You will probably find you need to go with a 1010LT which is more expensive and has one less output (if I'm remembering right).

I found two online vendors with them in stock for $139-149. M-audio store has them.

 

[RobWalker]

I've been looking for an M-Audio 410 card for a while now -- the supply seems to have really dried up, even on ebay. You will probably find you need to go with a 1010LT which is more expensive and has one less output (if I'm remembering right).

I found two online vendors with them in stock for $139-149. M-audio store has them.

Great -- though are we talking about the PCI version.

http://www.m-audio.com/index.php?do=produc...D=PCIinterfaces doesn't list the 410. Can you post a link.

Thanks.

 

[86turbodsl]

I've been looking for an M-Audio 410 card for a while now -- the supply seems to have really dried up, even on ebay. You will probably find you need to go with a 1010LT which is more expensive and has one less output (if I'm remembering right).

I found two online vendors with them in stock for $139-149. M-audio store has them.

Great -- though are we talking about the PCI version.

http://www.m-audio.com/index.php?do=produc...D=PCIinterfaces doesn't list the 410. Can you post a link.

Thanks.

http://store.m-audio.com/index.cfm?page=te...p;categoryid=88

I hope that works for you.

You're right ebay has nothing nowadays.

 

[RobWalker]

http://store.m-audio.com/index.cfm?page=te...p;categoryid=88

I hope that works for you.

You're right ebay has nothing nowadays.

Thanks -- I very nearly ordered a 1010LT last week, this is a much better solution.