New System Install - Door Contact Question

[jon102034050]

Hey all, been viewing and reading as much as possible - recently built and moved into a new house.  My builder pre-wired my house with an out of the box configuration.  I was able to tell them where to put motions, ran cat5e, and additional LV wiring, but I am unsure of what they ran to my doors...  In my LV closet, I've got 22/4 runs from each door, and the below picture is what I have in each jamb.  Is this some kind of proximity sensor?  Do I need all 4 wires?  Do I need to purchase the door sensors still?  I've got an Elk M1 system, and am trying to wrap my head around if additional work is required for them.
 
http://imgur.com/5l4yQWi
 
Thanks!

 

[RAL]

It could be a recessed magnetic contact, or a pre-wire dummy plug.  Do you see a magnet in the edge of the door directly across from where this is located in the jamb?  If so, then the installer probably installed and wired a contact. 
 
If not, it is probably a pre-wire dummy plug.  Pop it out and the alarm cable should be attached. 
 
Get yourself some recessed magnetic contacts that match the size of the plug hole (usually 3/8" or 3/4"). Connect the contact to the cable, and press it back into the door jamb.  Then, drill a matching hole for the magnet in the edge of the door and mount the magnet.
 
If you have a steel door, make sure you get a contact that is designed for use in steel doors.
 
You only need 22/2 for a typical door or window contact, although the installer may have run 22/4 simply because it was what he had on hand.

 

[jon102034050]

It could be a recessed magnetic contact, or a pre-wire dummy plug.  Do you see a magnet in the edge of the door directly across from where this is located in the jamb?  If so, then the installer probably installed and wired a contact. 
 
If not, it is probably a pre-wire dummy plug.  Pop it out and the alarm cable should be attached. 
 
Get yourself some recessed magnetic contacts that match the size of the plug hole (usually 3/8" or 3/4"). Connect the contact to the cable, and press it back into the door jamb.  Then, drill a matching hole for the magnet in the edge of the door and mount the magnet.
 
If you have a steel door, make sure you get a contact that is designed for use in steel doors.
 
You only need 22/2 for a typical door or window contact, although the installer may have run 22/4 simply because it was what he had on hand.

 
Ahh, good call. I'll see if I can pull it out and take a look there. The interesting thing is that when I requested door contacts for my garage doors, they put the actual contacts onto them...  They didn't stay consistent for some reason.
 
Thanks!!

 

[RAL]

If they installed contacts on the garage doors, then maybe they did install contacts in the other doors as well.
 
Before you try and pull this one out, check to see if you can tell whether it is a contact rather than a pre-wire plug.  Look for a magnet on the door itself.  You can also check the wiring at the other end in the wiring closet with a multimeter to see if you see a change in resistance between 2 of the wires in the cable when you open and close the door.   If the wires to the door are 22/4, you'll have to check different combinations of wires if you don't know which pair the installer wired to the contact.  The wiring to the garage door contact may give you a good hint as to which pair he used.

 

[jon102034050]

Well, I may be even more confused now...  I was able to pull it out, and there are 2 wires that are most definitely connected (not pictured, but are epoxied into the cylinder as well).  It seems to be made of plastic as well.  Also, there isn't a lot of slack with those wires either, I pulled it out as much as I felt comfortable to do, it was stressing the wires quite a bit.
 
http://imgur.com/hic6kZV
 
 

 

[RAL]

That's a magnetic contact and not a dummy plug.  The contact has pig tail wires that are spliced to the cable that runs back to the wiring closet.  Usually, there should be enough slack to pull the wire out to the splice point in case there are ever problems, but not every installer thinks to do that.
 
Is there any sign of a magnet in edge of the door?

 

[jon102034050]

Just for reference, the door that I am picturing here is my garage door.  There isn't a magnet on the door at all, nor is there one on my front door, which is some kind of composite wood looking door.  I've got to purchase a multimeter to test this, as you said.  But, is it possible that I need to just put a plate on the door itself?
 

That looks like a magnetic contact and not a dummy plug.  What you are seeing are pig tail wires that are spliced to the cable that runs back to the wiring closet.
 
Is there a magnet in edge of the door?

 

[jon102034050]

Seems like I may have only half of this product:
 
http://www.ebay.com/itm/GE-Interlogix-Sentrol-1075-N-1075-Window-Door-Alarm-Contact-White-3-8-recessed-/181640747456?pt=BI_Security_Fire_Protection&hash=item2a4aa1d9c0

 

[RAL]

Just for reference, the door that I am picturing here is my garage door.  There isn't a magnet on the door at all, nor is there one on my front door, which is some kind of composite wood looking door.  I've got to purchase a multimeter to test this, as you said.  But, is it possible that I need to just put a plate on the door itself?

 
 
Is this contact on the overhead garage door, or the passage door (for people)? 
 
 

Seems like I may have only half of this product:
 
http://www.ebay.com/itm/GE-Interlogix-Sentrol-1075-N-1075-Window-Door-Alarm-Contact-White-3-8-recessed-/181640747456?pt=BI_Security_Fire_Protection&hash=item2a4aa1d9c0

 
 
You need a magnet mounted on the door to make this work.  The one you linked to uses a bar type magnet, but you can also use a rare earth disc magnet, like the one below, if you don't want to drill such a deep hole in the door. 
 

 

[jon102034050]

Is this contact on the overhead garage door, or the passage door (for people)? 
 
 
 
 
You need a magnet mounted on the door to make this work.  The one you linked to uses a bar type magnet, but you can also use a rare earth disc magnet, like the one below, if you don't want to drill such a deep hole in the door. 
 

 
The sensor in question is the passenger door to the garage.  The actual car garage door sensors look similar to the following:
 
http://s246.photobucket.com/user/Sukimasterchef/media/171.jpg.html
 
I'm going to push this one back onto the electricians that wired the house, I'd say that it's an incomplete installation of the sensor.  Conveniently, they're scheduled to come back next week for some other items that they screwed up  
 
Thanks for the help!

 

[RAL]

Ok, you're in pretty good shape, then.    All you should need are the missing magnets and you should be all set.

 

[jon102034050]

Well, got the electricians to come back out and install the magnets on the doors themselves (I've got 6 doors so this wasn't something that I was eager to do if I could push it back on them).  They were very willing to install them, which was nice.  After they installed the magnets, all of the doors show the correct statuses in ElkRP except the door I was messing with.  The way I see it, 2 things could have happened here: 
 
1. The wiring is bad
2. The sensor is bad
 
I ordered up a multimeter and was able to confirm that something is goofy here, the multimeter reads 0 when I test the wires at the panel (and the door is closed).  My concern here is that I may have messed up with sensor/wiring by pulling it out to inspect it.  Does anybody have any suggestions on what I could do for further testing...?  

 

[RAL]

With the door closed, you a reading of 0 Ohms on the meter would be normal.   Make another measurement with the door open and see if it is still 0.  If it is 0, then there definitely is a problem.  
 
First, check where the cable is connected to the panel to make sure there isn't a short visible right there.
 
The most likely cause would be damage to the cable somewhere between the panel and the door.  Often, this is due to a wire staple that cut into the cable, or some other nail that was driven through the cable. Sometimes you can get a problem where the wire makes a sharp turn and was pulled too tight.  It could also be a bad contact, but I would say that is the least likely cause.  It's possible that in pulling out the contact, you caused the damage by pulling on the wire, but it would have taken a fair amount of force to do that (and the electrician should have left more slack).
 
Is part of the cable accessible anywhere, like in the basement or attic?  It might not be too difficult to isolate and repair if you can get to a good part of it.  A repair might require pulling a new cable, or at least a section of it.
 
If you don't think you are up to tackling this yourself, since your electricians are still willing to work with you, you could call them and see if they can repair it for you.  Many pros have meters that can test the cable and give a reading of where a short or open is located along the length of the cable.  That makes it a whole lot easier to isolate the problem.  

 

[jon102034050]

Well, after taking a reading on the wires with the door open and closed, they both read 0.  I checked connections on the panel and also re-seated them just to be sure - and got nothing.  I think I'll give the electricians a call tomorrow to see if they can send a guy out to diagnose it, as I mentioned, they've been pretty good about supporting their work so far.

 

[Del91574]

Sounds like they did a twist and pray connection or a non-staggered splice in tape and you pulled them together OR the cable is shorted by a staple or other item through it.
 
Too bad they didn't leave enough slack to get to the splice or pull it out completely.