Status update on my software decision - scale tipping to Cinemar...

[shenandoah75]

Well, My wife tells me to day that she hates our new system. Note this is simply my 30 day trial , no fancy screens, just the standard "pro" netRemote controlling whole house audio only at this point.... I could tell she had been tempted to throw the ipaq across the room...

Not good... For some reason, netremote had a hardtime finding the media bridge server everytime she turned on the ipaw. even though it was running. I think i fixed this by popping in the ip-adress instead of the machine name - so far no connection problems since. However, she doesn't like the navigation on the ipaq either and couldn't figure out how to get the thing to stop playing the same song over and over again. Holding the stylus over the playlist item in library may not have been easy to figure out though when you're used to a mouse click.... I think she would grow used to it...


Anyway, i've been testing mainlobby on my laptop and plan to offer her some displays of that tonight... I was reluctant to spend more, but it's gaining ground given the above and the fact i was able to get musiclobby and weather up and running pretty easily... If the elk integration (see irrigation/lighting below) is that easy i'd probably be sold... Looks like i may be able to do some swicthing directly on the M-audio card with the new beta plugin too (without an autopatch)



DavidL, i don't see the PPC plugins on the download from MLServer. Any chance i can get/try these? Namely = musiclobbyPPC. Right now, if she gives me a go, i'm looking at new server (unless your requirements are really a guidline and i can run on an athlon 600), the combo, elk, weather, jriver and maybe mlppc... Also, can i use the irrigation / lighting plugins with Elk control (this is a must- hopefully out of the box thing - lighting due to viziarf)? I will dig through the forums later on this, but i'm hoping/assuming so.... Also on the Sony Changer, is the 777ES the only one supported? If i pop both dvds and cds in the same box, how will i handle the musiclobby vs dvdlobby as a controller? or do i have to go through dvd lobby to pick cds too?

IVB, i saw you mentioned in a recent post, uploading a recording of your last session - i am namely am interested in seeing "CQC interface" portion if possible... any update?


thx
-brad

 

[IVB]

IVB, i saw you mentioned in a recent post, uploading a recording of your last session - i am namely am interested in seeing "CQC interface" portion if possible... any update?

I'll PM you the unedited file link, keep in mind that it's the overview bit. If you want, I got time now/tonight, if you want a gotomeeting to give you a more concise overview addressing just your concerns so you don't have to wade through 1hr 45mins of a 123MB file.

 

[jwilson56]

Well for one thing your comparing apples with oranges. Netremote runs on Windows systems and that is how I primarily use it. So you could just as easily used it on your laptop if you wanted to. Also you probably have autodetect enabled to look for mediabridge. I would suggest you configure it so that it knows the hostname or IP address of the PC that mediabridge is on and set it up that way and disable autodetect.

One of the complaints about using PPC's with WIFI for many HA projects is that when they come out of sleep most take way too long to re-establish connection to the network. This is not a problem with Netremote anymore than trying to use any other WIFI application with them.

John

 

[harleydude]

I agree with John.

I use NetRemote frequently on Windows based PC's and it works wonderfully, however PPC's is another story. This is not the fault of NetRemote or any other PPC/WiFi based application. Once connected to the network my PPC runs NetRemote without any issues as well, but it usually takes 10-15 seconds for the network to be aquired. I have considered running NetRemote on my PPC fulltime, but it does not provide a large enough screen to provide me with the the look I desire.

Just my .02 cents.

 

[shenandoah75]

fair enough... (and i find netremote extremely easy to use) so i'm not giving up entirely... i did get girder talking to my global cache last night which was a positive... I agree, since i'll have a touchscreen as the main interface, once that arrives, i'll let her try that out and see what she thinks... The big lack in promixis offering is a solid elk plugin. I have the elk plugin from the forum, but it looks to only support serial not ethernet connectivity (waiting on my cables/nulterms to arrive from ebay) and it looks like it only directly supports arming, etc out of the box. I know i'm gonna have to customize no matter which package i use, but the integration to Elk's lighting control and outputs/relays for sprinkler, pool, etc is a must have no matter which of the three i pick and it looks like they may more difficult to get up and running with netremote/girder. I know harleydude has done a lot more per his forum posts over there, but i think that should be out of the box... I can't spend hours on end getting any app (cqc, promixis, ML) up and running... I got a kitchen to build that needs that time and it looks to me like ML will be the easiest of the three for elk integration, though i wish they had some default scene files that were included with the plugin?



However, the scale changes by the hour

Right after i created this thread, i was back to struggling with music lobby similar to how i was the other day - so i couldn't demo to the mrs anyway... I have the server started in Jriver, the setup shows music lobby is connected and yet i get nothing in the media window but blank panels. If i manually start something playing in Jriver, i see a line in "now playing" window saying "media server not licensed", but clicking, etc does nothing... MLMedia Center plugin shows:

MLMediaCenter is now configured to support 1 MusicLobby Servers with 3 zones each.
MLMediaCenter is now initializing....
Ready to receive MusicLobby locator broadcast beacon from all MusicLobbyServers on the local network...
MLMediaCenter is now initialized and ready to start...

The main page shows 22 days remaining on trial....



So right now, netremote has ML beat on audio control simply cause it works with little intervention. And the default PPC client is far more robost based on direct usage of netremote and comparing to limited screen shots from cinemar's website - again a demo here would allow a true comparison. Plus, it isn't an extra addon...


I also tried testing an ML command to increment HAI temp via elk on the thermostat and that works! look like we must use non-secure port since there's no entry in the settings for password, etc...


MLServeCmd.MLELKM1|CSPINC~1


Got [CSPINC~1]
TCP/IP Sending [0Bts01804004A]
Rcvd: [23 bytes]
Rcvd: [13TR012007967800000FE]
Rcvd: Thermostat Data
End Event [6/27/2007 7:14:11 AM]
Rcvd: [23 bytes]
Rcvd: [13TR012007967800000FE]
Rcvd: Thermostat Data
End Event [6/27/2007 7:14:22 AM]
Rcvd: [26 bytes]
Rcvd: [16XK0600074270607110006D]
Rcvd: Ethernet Heartbeat
End Event [6/27/2007 7:14:25 AM]


So that's good, and with lighting lighting, i'm also successful.... But in general, i have a concern around the ML elk plugin are the available ranges stated on the wiki pages...
lighting: PLC: house A-P , Unit code 1..16

This would seem to indicate that i can't control all my lighting (i have more than 16 devices)? However, I tried the following commands and they work (G98 is the dimmer for my kitchen)... so i think that "16" a typo in the wiki page...

MLServeCmd.MLELKM1|PN~A~98
MLServeCmd.MLELKM1|PF~A~98
MLServeCmd.MLELKM1|PC~A~98~9~50~12 (not sure what the function("9") parameter is here though - extended ('50") seems to be the dim level can anyone clarify?)

So ML is indeed easy to get working with Elk as my controller - at least on the backend. That is promising, but i am not a graffics artist. And a default M1 scene that i could start with would be nice... I could spend money on the graffix packages, but that's gonna add up quick and to IVB's pasts threads, cost wise ML loses some of the price advantage over CQC if i have to buy the security and 14/17, thermostat, home libraries..



thx again to all input so far
-brad

 

[shenandoah75]

BTW - if spanky's watching, i find it interesting that direct commands from MLServer for toggle, duration work with my viziaRF devices, but rules defined in ElkRP do not... That doesn't make much sense to me...


DavidL, in conjunction with my portion on lighting above, is there any way to control fade rate. Thinking that might even work with viziarf here if the others do...

-brad

 

[WayneW]

The big lack in promixis offering is a solid elk plugin. I have the elk plugin from the forum, but it looks to only support serial not ethernet connectivity (waiting on my cables/nulterms to arrive from ebay) and it looks like it only directly supports arming, etc out of the box.

Serial port only shouldn't be an issue, you can use hw_vsp to create a virtual serial port that maps to an IP address. I have been using that trick for a year or two with Dan's my.elk script for HomeSeer. the script can only support a serial port, but hw_vsp lets it connect to the XEP.
http://www.hw-group.com/products/hw_vsp/index_en.html

 

[DavidL]

Brad, you might have a firewall or antivirus issue that is preventing the licensing messages from being sent between MainLobby Server (MLMediaCenter plugin) and the J river PC. this is covered in good detail in the Cinemar documentation wiki. It takes a few seconds for the handshake to occur. The J River plugin (musiclobbyserver.ocx) has to be Enabled in the J river plugin interface. As with all networked systems (which all of the robust automation systems are), proper networking (like addressing, name resolution, antivirus permissions, firewall permissions) have to be addressed. Sorry if this sound obvious, but it's not obvious to all and is often an area that gets shortcutted when evaluating quickly.

 

[shenandoah75]

Well - I'm using a combo/hybrid box - all the MLS, MLC, jriver are all running on the same machine...

 

[Ranger Digital]

shen, I am leaning towards mainlobby as well. I am convinced that CQC may be the most stable on the market and extremely flexible and likel the right choice for the highest end of HA, but for me the initial ease of main lobby and the impression it can make in a sales presentation (which cqc can do to but only after a huge learning curve and hours of programming) leans me to do mainlobby.

This is NOT to put down CQC at all but for a novice computer geek (me) it overwhelms me. Given time, I may at some point get to understand cqc more, but for now mainlobby is my choice. ML is course going to have its own learning curve as well. Plus i am excited about new products coming out.

My only concern is that i hope mainlobby is the right choice for on-q/hai. I still want the on-q to be the main controller and have mainlobby as the overlay. the on-q is powerful so i want to take advantage of its automation. i am learning mainlobby now and it BETTER be able to control all my alc switches or i will not be a happy camper.

 

[DavidL]

shenendoah, same box doesn't make a difference. You are still networking the components.

Do you by chance have more than one NIC card? MusicLobby will only support running on a PC with only One ethernet card enabled (including wireless). When more than one, the networking messages don't shuffle around correctly. This is something that will be changed in the near future.

 

[shenandoah75]

That's entirely possible...

Sure enough laptop has both - although only one was connected (wireless)... I just disabled wi-fi, started MLS . jriver, then the client... when i go to media, the music lobby windows display for about one sec, then the screen goes entirely blue can't click, etc... Looks like i'm getting somewhere though...

If i open 0019_media.musiclibrary.page2.mls, the left hand pain corrcetly shows zone1 playing star wars whichis what's playing in media center...

Any other tips?

-brad

 

[DavidL]

Send me a PM with your phone number and I will call you.
Easier than debugging via forum.

That's entirely possible...

Sure enough laptop has both - although only one was connected (wireless)... I just disabled wi-fi, started MLS . jriver, then the client... when i go to media, the music lobby windows display for about one sec, then the screen goes entirely blue can't click, etc... Looks like i'm getting somewhere though...

If i open 0019_media.musiclibrary.page2.mls, the left hand pain corrcetly shows zone1 playing star wars whichis what's playing in media center...

Any other tips?

-brad

 

[shenandoah75]

Thx David for the call and advice....

we can chat over phone again (gotta head out today), but here's current status:

1) i installed the mainlobby on a new pc - (after using flash deinstaller / new version), etc - same blue screen result
2) installed demo version of mainlobby/media lobby on the older athlon box and tried connecting with the same two clients. - same result as with the other server


Bottom line is everything looks to be in line... Zone alarm is disabled... Norton shouldn't be restricting anything. The plugin shows correct zones(4)/licensing(3 zones)/and it's started... I can access security/weather/thermostat (via) the elk plugin...All of those scene work/display correctly on the client. Only the media scene doesn't (i.e. 0019_media.musiclibrary).

interesting thing: if i stop the plugin in Jriver (12) the scene displays w/ buttons, just nothing else... but i can get to the setup and change the details. i.e. i can change from localhost to a true name/ip... but as soon as i start the server again, screen goes blue.

Again, this only started happening today, it didn't do this last night on the first machine. The only thing i can think of was the installation of several other plugins (elk, GC100, Maudio,irrigation lighting, temp). Not sure if one of these is causing a conflict, but i tried unloading them to no avail...


thx
-brad

 

[Dean Roddey]

This is NOT to put down CQC at all but for a novice computer geek (me) it overwhelms me. Given time, I may at some point get to understand cqc more, but for now mainlobby is my choice. ML is course going to have its own learning curve as well. Plus i am excited about new products coming out.

You are correct, no offense taken. CQC is not for novices at all, it's a pro-level system. We wouldn't want to try to imply that it's positioned as anything other than that. Not that you have to be an uber-geek by any means, but it's not for someone looking for a quick-n-dirty system setup or who feels very uncomfortable working with computers.

Just be aware that a lot of the issues, once you get into real automation, lie outside of the software package chosen anyway, and would remain the same (and fairly complex) no matter what you use.