Still having problems with ELK M1 and rc80b thermostats

[johnnynine]

When I send multiple consecutive commands to the RC80b thermostats, they sometimes don't get the setpoints updated properly. I'll come home in the summer to an 88 degree house even though a rule ran earlier in the day to set the cool setpoint to 81.

I have rules that activate either hvac economy mode task or hvac comfort mode task.

The Problem
The problem is that the temperatures only get set on the thermostats about 25%-50% of the time. This has been going on all this year at least.

Test 1: Confirmed that the tasks are running when expected.
I confirmed that the tasks are actually running by setting up an email as the 1st action in each task and let it run that way for a few days. I would get an email 100% of the time, but the thermostat temperatures wouldn't always be set.

Test 2
I also did another test by manually setting the upstairs thermostat to a bogus temperature which caused the "Remote" LCD text to disappear on the thermostat. I then activated the economy task. The "Remote" LCD text reappeared as if it was updated by the Elk M1, but the cool setpoint temperature we not set. I should probably do some more testing on this.

Test 3
If I program a rule to just set the cool or heat setpoint, it works 100% of the time, so I don't think there is a serial communication issue with the thermostats.

The Rules
WHENEVER HVAC EconomyMode (Task 4) IS ACTIVATED
THEN SET Downstairs (Tstat 1) HEATING DESIRED TEMP TO 68 DEG. F
THEN SET Downstairs (Tstat 1) COOLING DESIRED TEMP TO 88 DEG. F
THEN SET Downstairs (Tstat 1) TO AUTO
THEN SET Upstairs (Tstat 2) HEATING DESIRED TEMP TO 68 DEG. F
THEN SET Upstairs (Tstat 2) COOLING DESIRED TEMP TO 88 DEG. F
THEN SET Upstairs (Tstat 2) TO AUTO

WHENEVER HVAC ComfortMode (Task 5) IS ACTIVATED
THEN SET Downstairs (Tstat 1) HEATING DESIRED TEMP TO 73 DEG. F
THEN SET Downstairs (Tstat 1) COOLING DESIRED TEMP TO 82 DEG. F
THEN SET Downstairs (Tstat 1) TO AUTO
THEN SET Upstairs (Tstat 2) HEATING DESIRED TEMP TO 73 DEG. F
THEN SET Upstairs (Tstat 2) COOLING DESIRED TEMP TO 82 DEG. F
THEN SET Upstairs (Tstat 2) TO AUTO

Please help,
Thanks,

Johnny

edit: typo

 

[gcimmino]

Johnny, not sure if it will help you, but at one point I was having issues with the RC-80B and ended up inserting a

SET HOLD TO OFF

as the first line in my T-stat rules.

 

[eufreka]

Wow. I have been having problems with mine since I installed them...

The worst thing I see is that every so often, they "reboot" when you press any key on them (I keep meaning to make a video, but haven't gotten to it). This has happened intermittently since I installed them.

Recently, I started seeing a Serial Expander Trouble warning on my Elk keypad, but quite frankly have been too, too, too busy to investigate...

 

[dtreyes]

Now you make me rethink. I am planning to connect my RC80 to ELK and remove it from Homeseer control ! At present, it is running fine on Homeseer but would like to centralize control to ELK.

 

[johnnynine]

gcimmino: I don't want to turn hold off, since I don't want the thermostat to change if hold is set (however we rarely set it to hold).

eufreka: I have not seen any reboots, nor serial expander trouble.

 

[Mike]

On the reboot: Check how tight it is secured. The snap in attachment of the face to the base might be the culprit there (something I wonder if they improved in the newer model).
You also might want to call them. I remember I had to call them for something, and I was very impressed with how they handled it. I don't remember the issue, but I remember the service (guess that is a good thing).

On the controls:
1. Make sure you have the latest firmware for the serial adapter. There were updates specificly for this.
2. From earlier problems I had double rules (which I just checked and saw they were still in). For example, one at 8:30PM and one at 8:31PM. Again I think this was remnant from before the firmware updates, but I have not had my wife complain in a long time.
3. There was a recommendation to clear all programmed times, plus there is a setting that was recommended to be set on the unit. Something in the installer menu. I'll try to see if I can remember the setting, maybe that is related to your problem.

 

[gcimmino]

3. There was a recommendation to clear all programmed times, plus there is a setting that was recommended to be set on the unit. Something in the installer menu. I'll try to see if I can remember the setting, maybe that is related to your problem.

Mike, good point. I had forgotten about this, but the RCS-80 does come "pre-programmed" with times and setbacks. Those need to be erased for use with remote control.

 

[tmbrown97]

When I installed my thermostat, I set the option that fully disables schedule programming because I was tired of it overriding my setting with some factory set program despite having Hold on. Definitely worth trying.

Also, have you checked the setting right after it should've been set to make sure it's going? It's possible it's getting set when it should be, then overridden sometime between then and when you see it by the internal schedule.

 

[johnnynine]

It looks like this thread has gone a little off topic.

Does anyone have any suggestions on my original post?

I was hoping for a comment from Elk Products on this as well.

Thanks,
Johnny

 

[AnthonyZ]

Seems that there's a couple differnet issues being discussed here. I'm not an Elk guy so I'm unaware how their rules affect the RC80. I wonder if you're sending commands too quickly. The RC80's run at a whopping 100 baud, so if multiple commands are sent too quickly, it may be missing them. As for the reset, that's easy. RC80's are current HOGS. They will reset (screen shows all LCD functions at once, blanks and then resetes to "normal" without a call for heat or cool) if there isn't enough current from the 24VAC transformer driving them. Two options...either add an additional common to the bottom screw terminal (fixes 90% of the issues) or put in secondary 24VAC transformner and use the HAI stat isolation module.

 

[johnnynine]

Seems that there's a couple differnet issues being discussed here. I'm not an Elk guy so I'm unaware how their rules affect the RC80. I wonder if you're sending commands too quickly. The RC80's run at a whopping 100 baud, so if multiple commands are sent too quickly, it may be missing them.

I suspect this as well, but I'd like a confirmation from Elk, as well as a proposed work around. I don't believe there is any way to put a pause in the rule... except using timers... but that would be a real mess I think.

 

[johnnynine]

It's been about a year and I'm still having this same issue. Assuming it's a delay issue, I'm moving my rules over to j9ae to manage the thermostats and to put a few second delay between each command sent to the thermostats although I'd really like to keep the logic in the ELK M1 since the thermostats are directly connected to it.

Has anyone found a solution to this, or has ELK been able to duplicate this?

 

[BryanE]

Wow. I have been having problems with mine since I installed them...

The worst thing I see is that every so often, they "reboot" when you press any key on them (I keep meaning to make a video, but haven't gotten to it). This has happened intermittently since I installed them.

Recently, I started seeing a Serial Expander Trouble warning on my Elk keypad, but quite frankly have been too, too, too busy to investigate...

Are you running a Common wire? I've seen this problem numerous times. Pick up an HAI Thermostat Power Supply... I think they run around $14.95.

 

[BryanE]

The RC80's run at a whopping 100 baud, so if multiple commands are sent too quickly, it may be missing them.

I thought it was 300.

I've had the RC80 + M1 combo running for years without issue. What M1XSP firmware are you running?

 

[johnnynine]

Wow. I have been having problems with mine since I installed them...

The worst thing I see is that every so often, they "reboot" when you press any key on them (I keep meaning to make a video, but haven't gotten to it). This has happened intermittently since I installed them.

Recently, I started seeing a Serial Expander Trouble warning on my Elk keypad, but quite frankly have been too, too, too busy to investigate...

Are you running a Common wire? I've seen this problem numerous times. Pick up an HAI Thermostat Power Supply... I think they run around $14.95.

It's been 2 years since I installed the thermostats so I'm a a little rusty, but I do recall have all the wires including the power-ish wire.