Trouble connecting to AlarmRelay

[pete_c]

You have not seen the dialer go bad, Pete?

No with some 6 pro bono installs and myself personally with 4 installs of the OmniPro 2 panel.

I personally burnt a new OmniPro 2 panel wiring it up in the dark...HAI replaced it.

What would you do if you were having this issue?

Buy a used one.

It's tough to find a new board now, though I do already have a second old board that I wish I could get repaired. I wish I had a schematic and some troubleshooting info for the LT board.

What is wrong with the second old board? Buy another used one.

I know that the HAI repair database is still owned by Leviton. It would be great if they could make it public domain. Or someone could reverse engineer the old boards.

I'm thinking about maybe switching out for a Honeywell panel but would my components work with that? Door reed switches and motion sensors probably would, what about HAI temp/humidity sensors?

Yes and no on the HAI Temperature - Humidity sensors. Here have always had multiple HAI Temperature and Humidity sensors. Concurrently did also multiple 1-Wire networks (1990's).

I'd have to get a new console too, no doubt. And an expansion board and second power supply...

Yes.

I have always preferred wired over wireless relating to everything security related. House #2 doesn't need security, CCTV, Automation. It is my personal sandbox.

Personally way back liked the add of automation to the HAI and Elk security panels. In the 1980's here purchased a combo security panel with speech, X10 and many zones. The alarm panel board was the size of an iTX computer board. Name was Excalibur and found it in an advertisement in Radio Electronics at the time. I kept that board going until around 2001.

Its really up to you what it is you want to do and what you want to tinker with or not.

 

[dwalt]

Are there any other issues that could damage a board? Transformer going bad? I just don't know why the dialer would work great for a day and then quit. All else I have on the board are door sensors, temp/humidity sensors, and motion sensors. And the backup battery.

GeorgieC,
Of all the systems I have installed, I have seen the dialer fail a few times (out of hundreds of installs). When it fails you can still hear the relays clicking. To test I just changed the call out number to my cell phone to see if it would ring and hear data. Failures I have seen were systems on POTS (plain old telephone service). This means copper coming in to the home from your phone company. Even if you put surge suppressors on the power, power spikes can come in the copper phone lines (especially during storms). That's why OnQ sold this product:

Discontinued - Telecom Surge Suppression Unit | Power Modules | Power Management | Audio/Visual

A plug-in module that protects all four incoming telephone pairs. Can be used on any Legrand Telecom Modules with service input.

www.legrand.us

I had a few of these blow out from surges on the phone line. They did protect the alarm though.

Don

 

[RAL]

One last thing you could check. Use a DC voltmeter and measure the on-hook and off-hook voltage between the tip and ring wires connecting the panel to the BAT. Off hook voltage should be about 6 volts. Some dialers look for that voltage before attempting to dial. If the BAT is delivering a too high or too low voltage, that might confuse the dialer.

If you don't see the proper voltage, you can disconnect the panel from the BAT and connect a 680 ohm resistor across the BAT terminals. If you still see an incorrect voltage, that would point to the BAT as being the source of the problem.

 

[GeorgieC]

GeorgieC,
Of all the systems I have installed, I have seen the dialer fail a few times (out of hundreds of installs). When it fails you can still hear the relays clicking. To test I just changed the call out number to my cell phone to see if it would ring and hear data. Failures I have seen were systems on POTS (plain old telephone service). This means copper coming in to the home from your phone company. Even if you put surge suppressors on the power, power spikes can come in the copper phone lines (especially during storms). That's why OnQ sold this product:

Discontinued - Telecom Surge Suppression Unit | Power Modules | Power Management | Audio/Visual

A plug-in module that protects all four incoming telephone pairs. Can be used on any Legrand Telecom Modules with service input.

www.legrand.us

I had a few of these blow out from surges on the phone line. They did protect the alarm though.

Don

Oh, yes, Don, I do have that surge suppressor. I don't have a landline anymore, though.

 

[GeorgieC]

You have not seen the dialer go bad, Pete?

No with some 6 pro bono installs and myself personally with 4 installs of the OmniPro 2 panel.

I personally burnt a new OmniPro 2 panel wiring it up in the dark...HAI replaced it.

What would you do if you were having this issue?

Buy a used one.

It's tough to find a new board now, though I do already have a second old board that I wish I could get repaired. I wish I had a schematic and some troubleshooting info for the LT board.

What is wrong with the second old board? Buy another used one.

I know that the HAI repair database is still owned by Leviton. It would be great if they could make it public domain. Or someone could reverse engineer the old boards.

I'm thinking about maybe switching out for a Honeywell panel but would my components work with that? Door reed switches and motion sensors probably would, what about HAI temp/humidity sensors?

Yes and no on the HAI Temperature - Humidity sensors. Here have always had multiple HAI Temperature and Humidity sensors. Concurrently did also multiple 1-Wire networks (1990's).

I'd have to get a new console too, no doubt. And an expansion board and second power supply...

Yes.

I have always preferred wired over wireless relating to everything security related. House #2 doesn't need security, CCTV, Automation. It is my personal sandbox.

Personally way back liked the add of automation to the HAI and Elk security panels. In the 1980's here purchased a combo security panel with speech, X10 and many zones. The alarm panel board was the size of an iTX computer board. Name was Excalibur and found it in an advertisement in Radio Electronics at the time. I kept that board going until around 2001.

Its really up to you what it is you want to do and what you want to tinker with or not.

I definitely want to keep tinkering. If I'm going to find a new board, would I have issues switching to an LTe? Would my keypad work with it? My expansion board wouldn't I guess, but it has more inputs and a little more power. Anything beyond that would be overkill for my needs.

 

[GeorgieC]

One last thing you could check. Use a DC voltmeter and measure the on-hook and off-hook voltage between the tip and ring wires connecting the panel to the BAT. Off hook voltage should be about 6 volts. Some dialers look for that voltage before attempting to dial. If the BAT is delivering a too high or too low voltage, that might confuse the dialer.

If you don't see the proper voltage, you can disconnect the panel from the BAT and connect a 680 ohm resistor across the BAT terminals. If you still see an incorrect voltage, that would point to the BAT as being the source of the problem.

Measuring voltage at the C-BAT tip & ring with the multimeter, it is normally about 48. When an alarm is set and the line picks up, voltage goes down to a little over 5 when you hear dial tone. When the line hangs up, voltage goes back up to around 48.

 

[RAL]

Measuring voltage at the C-BAT tip & ring with the multimeter, it is normally about 48. When an alarm is set and the line picks up, voltage goes down to a little over 5 when you hear dial tone. When the line hangs up, voltage goes back up to around 48.

Those are good voltages. That would indicate to me that it is the panel that is the problem.

 

[ano]

Have you looked here? Basically a similar problem, but also some HAI debugging ideas.

https://cocoontech.com/threads/omni-pro-ii-communicator-trbl-now-issue.29366/

 

[pete_c]

If I'm going to find a new board, would I have issues switching to an LTe? Would my keypad work with it?

Not really. Your keypad should work.

My expansion board wouldn't I guess, but it has more inputs and a little more power. Anything beyond that would be overkill for my needs.

Not sure if the expansion board would work with an LTe. I think they are all the same.

Purchasing only OmniPro 2 boards here was way overkill for me.

 

[dwalt]

If I'm going to find a new board, would I have issues switching to an LTe? Would my keypad work with it?

Not really. Your keypad should work.

My expansion board wouldn't I guess, but it has more inputs and a little more power. Anything beyond that would be overkill for my needs.

Not sure if the expansion board would work with an LTe. I think they are all the same.

@pete_c

To clarify, The OmniLT expansion board will not work on an LTe or any other Omni board. The LTe doesn't support any hardwired zone expansion. This strangeness burned me on an upgrade... The LTe only supports 16 zone wireless expansion. So max expansion on the LTe is 16 hw zones, 16 wireless zones and 8 outputs.
The original LT supports 24 hw zones and 10 outputs or 8 hw zones, 16 wireless zones and 10 outputs.

Also if upgrading from the OmniLT the transformer changes from 16 volts to 24 volts.
dwalt

 

[GeorgieC]

@pete_c

To clarify, The OmniLT expansion board will not work on an LTe or any other Omni board. The LTe doesn't support any hardwired zone expansion. This strangeness burned me on an upgrade... The LTe only supports 16 zone wireless expansion. So max expansion on the LTe is 16 hw zones, 16 wireless zones and 8 outputs.
The original LT supports 24 hw zones and 10 outputs or 8 hw zones, 16 wireless zones and 10 outputs.

Also if upgrading from the OmniLT the transformer changes from 16 volts to 24 volts.
dwalt

So 16 zones total, unless you want to do some wireless, which I don't. Do you know if the first 4 zones each have a separate jumper or must all 4 be configured fire/smoke? Can I use zone 1 for smokes and zones 2-4 as auxiliary? How many zones would I have available for sensors like door, motion, water, etc?

Are the hardwired zones on the LTe and the IIe set up the same?

 

[dwalt]

@GeorgieC ,
The first 4 zones have smoke detector jumpers. You can set each zone up as whatever type you want. If you have one smoke detector zone, that leaves you 15 standard zones. The Omni2e is the same. The OmniLTe, Omni2e and OmniProII are all based on the same circuit board.
Here is a link to the Omni LTe install and Omni2e install manuals:

https://www.leviton.com/en/docs/PK-93405-10-B0-0A-W.pdf

https://www.leviton.com/en/docs/PK-93404-10-B0-0A-W.pdf

 

[GeorgieC]

@GeorgieC ,
The first 4 zones have smoke detector jumpers. You can set each zone up as whatever type you want. If you have one smoke detector zone, that leaves you 15 standard zones. The Omni2e is the same. The OmniLTe, Omni2e and OmniProII are all based on the same circuit board.
Here is a link to the Omni LTe install and Omni2e install manuals:

https://www.leviton.com/en/docs/PK-93405-10-B0-0A-W.pdf

https://www.leviton.com/en/docs/PK-93404-10-B0-0A-W.pdf

Don, Is there a certain year you wouldn't get one of these boards before? Do you run into the same issue I had with the LT of the eeprom needing updating?

 

[dwalt]

Don, Is there a certain year you wouldn't get one of these boards before? Do you run into the same issue I had with the LT of the eeprom needing updating?

You can't go by year. You need to look at the eprom. The version is printed on it. Version 3.0 came out in 2009 so anything 2009 or newer.

 

[GeorgieC]

You can't go by year. You need to look at the eprom. The version is printed on it. Version 3.0 came out in 2009 so anything 2009 or newer.

Some of the boards I'm seeing seem to have 2 eeproms with different version numbers on them, what's the deal with that? Sorry I'm a dope and thanks for answering all my questions!