Which Switch

[walken100]

I'm looking for a 3-way switch and companion with the following features
- X10 capable
- notification of local activation
- "true rocker action"

I've checked the technologies spreadsheet and it appears that I can do what I want but I'm having trouble identifying the actual vendors and parts. I've called some vendors but the information I've been provided has discrepancies relative to their own advertisements. So instead of hoping that I get what I want I thought I'd ask.

I've also searched extensively but haven't gotten to the bottom of the problem. I suspect that the information is in the forum and I just haven't found it. If you can shed some light on this or point to a link that does I would really appreciate it.

Cost is a factor but not critical. At this point I'm doing some experimenting to see what like before I jump in with both feet. I currently have some older x10 switches that work great but don't provide notification of local activation and feel like crap. Before I change technologies I want to see if there is an option that I like in X10.

Thanks
Bart

 

[Rupp]

Where are you finding any toggle style X10 switches? I though these were long gone other than the Insteon/X10 switches.

 

[walken100]

Where are you finding any toggle style X10 switches? I though these were long gone other than the Insteon/X10 switches.

Not sure what you mean by "toggle style". If you mean press top for on, press bottom for off that is what "true rocker" means to me (and to the manufacturers apparently). X10pro, leviton, and Insteon all say they have these but there is some confusion over what is what. X10pro doesn't announce a local activation according to the help line but I thought I'd read otherwise. Leviton appears to have a mix but according the rep the "green line" will announce a local activation but according to some vendors and advertisements not all of them do.

 

[ano]

Where are you finding any toggle style X10 switches? I though these were long gone other than the Insteon/X10 switches.

Not sure what you mean by "toggle style". If you mean press top for on, press bottom for off that is what "true rocker" means to me (and to the manufacturers apparently). X10pro, leviton, and Insteon all say they have these but there is some confusion over what is what. X10pro doesn't announce a local activation according to the help line but I thought I'd read otherwise. Leviton appears to have a mix but according the rep the "green line" will announce a local activation but according to some vendors and advertisements not all of them do.

2-way X-10 switches exist but they are expensive. Honestly X-10 is on its way out. I've look at a UPB switches, then you could buy a two-way X-10 to UPB bridge, like this one X-10 to UPB Bridge

Then you can control them with X-10, but not waste lots of money on obsolete X-10 switches. When you eventually switch to UPB, this device also can convert back to X-10 so you still can control those switches.

 

[BLH]

The Insteon SwitchLinc switches are true rocker. Push the top to go On or brighten and the bottom to dim or turn Off.
They can have an X10 address added to them. I use my SwitchLinc relay switches with both an X10 and Insteon controller. They do send an X10 On and Off when locally controlled.

There are a few things about the Insteon Switches.
They all need a neutral power wire so if your old X10 switches are two wire and there is no neutral in the box you have a problem.

Unlike X10 three way switches where a companion can control the main switch. With an Insteon switch you need two switches and cap the load on the slave switch.

With SwitchLinc dimming switches. If you locally adjust their brightness, they send an X10 %dim when the rocker is released. X10 controllers like the CM15A with AHP do not understand a %dim. At 100% Bright or 0% Dim they do send an On or Off and not the %dim .

 

[walken100]

With SwitchLinc dimming switches. If you locally adjust their brightness, they send an X10 %dim when the rocker is released. X10 controllers like the CM15A with AHP do not understand a %dim. At 100% Bright or 0% Dim they do send an On or Off and not the %dim .

Thanks for the info. Do you know of an X10 controller that does understand a %dim?

 

[walken100]

2-way X-10 switches exist but they are expensive. Honestly X-10 is on its way out. I've look at a UPB switches, then you could buy a two-way X-10 to UPB bridge, like this one X-10 to UPB Bridge

Then you can control them with X-10, but not waste lots of money on obsolete X-10 switches. When you eventually switch to UPB, this device also can convert back to X-10 so you still can control those switches.

I'm considering different technologies but wanted to be sure I understand the different technologies before I pick. Starting with X10 because I had some stuff so it was inexpensive to use as an educational platform. Once I understand the different features that I'm interested in I can make a choice. Hard to gain a perspective on the features without some hands on time. UPB will be one of the tougher ones to play with since its entry cost appears to be a little steeper than others. One controllable 3-way switch will cost a bunch. So I'll likely play with other technologies first.

 

[Rupp]

I have several Leviton switches still installed and they do report their status. I also have a few Insteon switches installed with X10 addresses. The more Insteon switched you install the more trouble your X10 installation will give you. It seems the Insteon switches start eating X10 signals the more switches you install. The Leviton switches I have are much higher quality than the Insteon as well. I can tell you that the "notification of local activation" is nice but I find I only care about one switch. All the other switches HomeSeer controls and knows about their status. So if your X10 install is working well and you can find the Leviton 2-way switches go for it otherwise, Insteon and UPB are good replacements.

 

[walken100]

I have several Leviton switches still installed and they do report their status. I also have a few Insteon switches installed with X10 addresses. The more Insteon switched you install the more trouble your X10 installation will give you. It seems the Insteon switches start eating X10 signals the more switches you install. The Leviton switches I have are much higher quality than the Insteon as well. I can tell you that the "notification of local activation" is nice but I find I only care about one switch. All the other switches HomeSeer controls and knows about their status. So if your X10 install is working well and you can find the Leviton 2-way switches go for it otherwise, Insteon and UPB are good replacements.

Do you know the model number of the leviton switches you are using?

 

[pete_c]

I currently have a whole house full of Insteon switches. Primarily utilizing X10 to communicate to these switches via my HAI panel and secondarily using Insteon via my HA server. I have no problems with communications. Its been in place for about 5 years. Most recently installed about 5 Leviton 6343's in a second house and working well.

I am also looking at updating and have started to update to both UPB and Z-Wave.

 

[walken100]

I currently have a whole house full of Insteon switches. Primarily utilizing X10 to communicate to these switches via my HAI panel and secondarily using Insteon via my HA server. I have no problems with communications. Its been in place for about 5 years. Most recently installed about 5 Leviton 6343's in a second house and working well.

I am also looking at updating and have started to update to both UPB and Z-Wave.

What is driving your desire to update to UPB and Z-Wave? Commmunication, quality, look and feel, other???? Just curious.

 

[Rupp]

I have several Leviton switches still installed and they do report their status. I also have a few Insteon switches installed with X10 addresses. The more Insteon switched you install the more trouble your X10 installation will give you. It seems the Insteon switches start eating X10 signals the more switches you install. The Leviton switches I have are much higher quality than the Insteon as well. I can tell you that the "notification of local activation" is nice but I find I only care about one switch. All the other switches HomeSeer controls and knows about their status. So if your X10 install is working well and you can find the Leviton 2-way switches go for it otherwise, Insteon and UPB are good replacements.

Do you know the model number of the leviton switches you are using?

I will have to look when I get home tonight. I installed these years ago.

 

[AutomatedOutlet]

Barton,

You have several choices.

If you want a true slave switch with the master switch, Leviton and Smarthome no longer have this. The only way to do it with those is to get two master switches and "link" them together.

The Lightolier Compose switches will do what you want to and have a true master/slave solution. Compose has been discontinued by Lightolier but we can still get them and probably have some in stock.

I am traveling in Kansas this week but if you call the office, I'm sure someone can help you.

thanks!

Martin Custer
214-245-4594

 

[walken100]

Barton,

You have several choices.

If you want a true slave switch with the master switch, Leviton and Smarthome no longer have this. The only way to do it with those is to get two master switches and "link" them together.

And the confusion (for me) continues. Levitons site shows installation instructions for their green line 3 way installations with a different companion switch (MSE0R-10W) which appears to be a slave of sorts but is from their red line. Perhaps I'm using "slave" incorrectly.

 

[Rupp]

Barton,

You have several choices.

If you want a true slave switch with the master switch, Leviton and Smarthome no longer have this. The only way to do it with those is to get two master switches and "link" them together.

And the confusion (for me) continues. Levitons site shows installation instructions for their green line 3 way installations with a different companion switch (MSE0R-10W) which appears to be a slave of sorts but is from their red line. Perhaps I'm using "slave" incorrectly.

Yea, this is another reason many of us are moving away from X10, the product lines are drying up and thus the patch work. I would recommend looking at the Insteon switches that will still do X10 as at least these are in full production.