Windows Home Server

[Frunple]

I agree with Mike about drobo. What a waste to be only a USB drive. Todays backups need to be networked devices.

 

[CollinR]

Does WHS act as a terminal server too? That would be the only read benefit I can think of as a *nix TS won't give the desktop feel or application support.

 

[Micah]

I don't think you should have to pick and choose what is important to you. The entire system is.

I agree with you but compromise is the word of the day. Raid5 was perfect for me, until the hard drives I bought at a premium just a couple of years ago were no longer worth purchasing and a single drive could hold more space than 4 of my 300 gig drives.

As I said in my post, and you pointed out in your own, there's things about WHS that are less than stellar but in my opinion the benefits out weigh the drawbacks.

If I lose 300gb worth of DVDs, meh. It's an investment in time but isn't the end of the world. I know people will go so far as to calculate what they feel they're worth per hour and use that as a basis to justify backup schemes but it isn't that important to me. The data is still there in some form or another and I'll get around to it eventually.

If the C:\ drive goes down, meh. It's just a matter of reinstalling the OS on a new drive and I'm back in business. The same kind of failure is possible with whatever arraying scheme you're using whether it is linux, hardware raid or a NAS device. Something critical could fail; that's just the nature of the game.

In regards to just a NAS device, they're handy and if I were just doing an HTPC I might look at them but I use my WHS box as my automation controller as well and need a dedicated 24x7 computer running. I could transfer that responsibility to my HTPC but I tend to do more playing (read: breaking) with my HTPC than my server.

There's other added benefits, like the automatic backup of other computers, that's just icing on the cake. At the end of the day, in regard to cost, comfort level, etc., WHS does what I want and does it decently well. It's not perfect in quite a few ways but for me, it's the best choice...at least for now.

 

[DavidL]

One nice feature about WHS is it's ability to efficiently backup all xp / MCE / Vista pcs on the LAN. It does this by storing a cluster of data once, and putting a database entry of that cluster and which PC it came from (non techno description). It will do same for all PCs. Then, if the clusters are same, it will only store it once, and put two pointers in the database.

Example of it's use: On those LAN PCs, one of the common apps might be MainLobby. This might be 10 - 60 gig of "stuff". The files that may be different from PC to PC might be a meg or two. To backup all of the PCs running MainLobby, you are only backing up MainLobby "once", with a relatively few clusters that are unique from PC to PC. So, if you are running 5 PCs running MainLobby client, you only need the backup space for one to backup all 5.

With RAID, this is not how it's done. You would be cloning or imaging or file copying each PC individually, and then storing that image across multiple drives and a drive or two more for backup protection of the hardware. ie: use more space.

The other thing is that these backups occur automagically. Now, if you are good with software selection, installation and configuring (and do it), this is no great feat....but for the rest of the world, this is important stuff to keep running trouble free.

Also, PCs are becoming our media central. Single source storage of those big ole files is important for saving money, and saving sanity by decreasing complexity. WHS provides an easy to configure means to share content to who you want to share it with. Again, "easy" stuff for techno wizards, but "hard" stuff for everyone else.

I am really impressed with the quality of the installation of WHS. Definately the easiest installs I have done. And, setting up the other PCs on the LAN to do the above is equally easy.

What I don't like about WHS is Microsoft's very limited view of what WHS is for. Their discussions talk about how nice WHS will be for "Home Automation" et al, but their certification process for OEM's is completely counter productive for those purposes. ie: limits on serial ports and other I/O stuff, adding custom shared folders in an initial build, etc. Funky stuff for an automation controller.

What I really like about WHS, is even though their Certification process doesn't support HA, their software does just fine. MainLobby / MainLobby Server runs on it very nicely, and that is the most important part for us

 

[thewireguy]

You could use the Drobo with WHS.... just plug it in and add it to the pool.

 

[huggy59]

So WHS comes with 10 CALs, anyone running more than 10 machines on their network? What's the CAL pricing per additional machine?

 

[sic0048]

If reliable storage is all you want, you are better off investing in a drobo unit. It is expensive ($499), but check out the video, it's pretty impressive.

interesting idea, but you are limited to 4 drives. So that is pretty limiting IMHO. You can mix and match drive sizes, but cannot install more than 4 drives at a time. I'll probably be switching to WHS myself. I also use CQC and already have a computer up 24/7.

In case anyone cares, MS just released a 120 evaluation version of WHS on their site. You have to pay for shipping and tax for a grand total of 6.34, but they will send you the actual DVDs for installation.

I just ordered my copy today - this will give me several months to try it out before having to buy the OEM version.

 

[electron]

If you need more than 4 terrabytes for critical stuff (pictures etc, not DVD movies), then you got bigger problems :lol: If you do want to go the software route, I would still recommend FreeNAS, it is much more mature, supports a lot of options that you won't find in any other product ... assuming we are still talking storage here.

 

[MikeB]

Does WHS act as a terminal server too? That would be the only read benefit I can think of as a *nix TS won't give the desktop feel or application support.

You can RDP to a WHS, I'm assuming 2 concurrent sessions since it's based on Windows Server 2003, though I've never tested it. You can also use your WHS as a gateway to remotely control other workstations on your LAN through the web.

If I lose 300gb worth of DVDs, meh. It's an investment in time but isn't the end of the world. I know people will go so far as to calculate what they feel they're worth per hour and use that as a basis to justify backup schemes but it isn't that important to me. The data is still there in some form or another and I'll get around to it eventually.

If the C:\ drive goes down, meh. It's just a matter of reinstalling the OS on a new drive and I'm back in business. The same kind of failure is possible with whatever arraying scheme you're using whether it is linux, hardware raid or a NAS device. Something critical could fail; that's just the nature of the game.

I understand what you're saying, and you're right - but I guess that's a personal choice. 5 years ago I might have said "who cares if I need to reload the OS", but nowadays my life is much more full with the family, work, and all the other gadgets going on here. The fewer things that can go wrong in my house, the better - because the last thing I want to do is create more work for myself. :lol:

 

[CollinR]

Does WHS act as a terminal server too? That would be the only read benefit I can think of as a *nix TS won't give the desktop feel or application support.

You can RDP to a WHS, I'm assuming 2 concurrent sessions since it's based on Windows Server 2003, though I've never tested it. You can also use your WHS as a gateway to remotely control other workstations on your LAN through the web.

Try it out and see, if it is a legit terminal server that adds a huge bonus.

 

[MikeB]

Does WHS act as a terminal server too? That would be the only read benefit I can think of as a *nix TS won't give the desktop feel or application support.

You can RDP to a WHS, I'm assuming 2 concurrent sessions since it's based on Windows Server 2003, though I've never tested it. You can also use your WHS as a gateway to remotely control other workstations on your LAN through the web.

Try it out and see, if it is a legit terminal server that adds a huge bonus.

Phew, glad I did. Only 1 more day to activate! :lol:

Yes, I was able to get 2 concurrent RDP sessions going at once. I wouldn't necessarily consider it a 'legit' terminal server unless you can install terminal server licensing and get more than 2 concurrent sessions. I'm certain Microsoft would not support that scenario, but it probably can be done.

 

[CollinR]

This is the only benefit I see for it and I doubt I am alone in that. I would guess you caould support all 10 desktops.


It would be very interesting to find this limit as you can get thin clients for $20 now, actually local to me too. :lol:

 

[roussell]

One nice feature about WHS is it's ability to efficiently backup all xp / MCE / Vista pcs on the LAN. It does this by storing a cluster of data once, and putting a database entry of that cluster and which PC it came from (non techno description). It will do same for all PCs. Then, if the clusters are same, it will only store it once, and put two pointers in the database.

FWIW, you can do this with Linux too. BackupPC will do "Single Instance" copies of files, perform backups automatically, and will even ping an address looking for a machine, and when it connects; it start a backup. It has worked well for my wife and I - each having laptops with the same pictures and MP3s - only storing one copy of each saves a ton of space.

Terry

 

[DavidL]

One nice feature about WHS is it's ability to efficiently backup all xp / MCE / Vista pcs on the LAN. It does this by storing a cluster of data once, and putting a database entry of that cluster and which PC it came from (non techno description). It will do same for all PCs. Then, if the clusters are same, it will only store it once, and put two pointers in the database.

FWIW, you can do this with Linux too. BackupPC will do "Single Instance" copies of files, perform backups automatically, and will even ping an address looking for a machine, and when it connects; it start a backup. It has worked well for my wife and I - each having laptops with the same pictures and MP3s - only storing one copy of each saves a ton of space.

Terry

Yes, I am sure there is a Linux solution that is similar. But, then you're jumping into a Linux world to be comfy in, and that's not a little deal for most. Ok for the more technical, but not for the portion of the computing world that Microsoft is intending WHS for (that is already comfy with Windows).

 

[MikeB]

FWIW, you can do this with Linux too. BackupPC will do "Single Instance" copies of files, perform backups automatically, and will even ping an address looking for a machine, and when it connects; it start a backup. It has worked well for my wife and I - each having laptops with the same pictures and MP3s - only storing one copy of each saves a ton of space.

WHS will also allow full image backups of workstations. If a hard disk dies, simply replace it, boot up to the included boot CD, and restore from your network backup - very very simple.

Yes, I am sure there is a Linux solution that is similar. But, then you're jumping into a Linux world to be comfy in, and that's not a little deal for most. Ok for the more technical, but not for the portion of the computing world that Microsoft is intending WHS for (that is already comfy with Windows).

Also not OK for anyone who needs to run Windows applications on the server.



Linux is great, don't get me wrong, but it's not the solution for everything or everyone.