Z-Wave Thermostat

[jarcher]

Hi All...

I'l in the process ov moving most of my plugs and switches to Vizia Z-Wave and, along the way, I am thinking I should put in a new thermostat as well. I have forced hot air heating and central AC, so I need a device that can control all that. Can you folks share your thoughts and experiences with different models you have tried? One thing that might be nice is if the temp sensor (or sensors) were not part of the thermostat itself, as it might be nice to hide it. Or, if not hide it, at least put the keypad in a spot that may not be the ideal spot for the temp sensors.

 

[IVB]

If you were to relax the zWave requirement and move to a Home Automation PC, that would be quite simple. I use an Aprilaire 8870 HVAC thermo, various elk and qkits vk011 temp sensors (mounted soon, just got them) to handle this. As you're probably painfully aware, I use CQC to integrate communications, monitoring, & control between them all.

zWave is useful and all, but as of now it's no one-stop-shop for this.

 

[Micah]

DON'T DO IT!

I currently have a TZ16 and out of all my HA purchases to date, it was the worst.

Unless something has changed there's only a single Master Remote that "supports" thermstat control and that is ACT's ZTH100. What ACT doesn't tell you, however, is that while the remote "supports" ZWave thermostats it's only for manual control. You can't program time changes into the remote and the TZ16 is nothing more than a dumb terminal that can't program itself.

Unless you have a different software or hardware package that can control ZWave thermostats directly and others have confirmed that they are doing it already, I would avoid going the ZWave route for this. I've got a $250 thermostat that has fewer features than a $50 thermostat and it makes my blood boil every time I look at it.

 

[Rupp]

DON'T DO IT!

I currently have a TZ16 and out of all my HA purchases to date, it was the worst.

Unless something has changed there's only a single Master Remote that "supports" thermstat control and that is ACT's ZTH100. What ACT doesn't tell you, however, is that while the remote "supports" ZWave thermostats it's only for manual control. You can't program time changes into the remote and the TZ16 is nothing more than a dumb terminal that can't program itself.

Unless you have a different software or hardware package that can control ZWave thermostats directly and others have confirmed that they are doing it already, I would avoid going the ZWave route for this. I've got a $250 thermostat that has fewer features than a $50 thermostat and it makes my blood boil every time I look at it.

The TZ-16 is currently being redesigned. There's always the Camstat. It's an ok thermostat.
http://store.homeseer.com/store/Z-Wave-The...tat-P13C38.aspx

The premire line of automation thermostats are the HAI line. They are nice looking and relatively inexpensive. The serial models are the best and I'm sure most HA packages have plugins to control these plugins. I use HomeSeer and it has a free plugin for this line of thermostats.

http://www.hometech.com/modules/therm.html

 

[jarcher]

Thanks everyone, I'll look at all those. If I were to dump the Z-Wave requirement as IVB suggested, what would I lose? Ultimately, I want a thermostat that I can use with or without a PC. It would be nice to be able to control it from an RF remote, but if we're not there yet I can sure live without that.

 

[jarcher]

Oh, I should have mentioned, the entire house is just one HAVC zone. It's an older house, and with forced hot air you don't have the ability to have many zones. The reason I wanted more than one temp sensor was because the second floor tends to be warmer than the first in the summer and I was thinking it would be nice to monitor the temps seperatly and maybe have the thermotat act on an average of the temps. Better yet, in the night when we're sleeping, maybe the second floor sensor could control but during the day, an average could control.

 

[Micah]

Any of the HA type thermostats can be used without a PC, they work just like a regular thermostat. All that a ZWave enabled thermostat does is allows you to control it over the ZWave network vs hardwiring it back to whatever you're using as a HA box (be that an dedicated panel like an Elk or a PC running one of the many HA software packages) and having control with/through that.

I would ignore the ZWave requirement for now and try to figure out how to integrate your thermostat with what you already have. If you're using software on a PC through a touchscreen or visual based menu then you'll probably want to control the thermostat the same way which means you just need to see what thermostats your software/panel supports. If you're doing ZWave lighting independent of any additional hardware then ZWave may indeed be the way to go despite what I said earlier.

 

[jarcher]

If you were to relax the zWave requirement and move to a Home Automation PC, that would be quite simple. I use an Aprilaire 8870 HVAC thermo, various elk and qkits vk011 temp sensors (mounted soon, just got them) to handle this. As you're probably painfully aware, I use CQC to integrate communications, monitoring, & control between them all.

I just read the web site and owners manual for this device, but I'm missing something. How does it communicate with a PC and remote temp sensors? Is it Wifi, wired ethernet? The owners manual made reference to baud rate of 19200, so is it actually RS232?

I am guessing that this is mostly a relatively dumb interface between a PC and the HVAC equipment. That's okay with me, I am just trying to understand exactly what I can do with it. Am I correct in guessing that, if I wanted to control it from a Z-Wave remote, I could have the remote send commands to my PC and the PC then execute them via the thermostat?

Thanks very much...

 

[IVB]

An 8870 uses a hardwired connection (CAT5) to link to an 8811 RS232 adapter which hooks into your PC.

I don't know much about zWave remotes, but the basic theory is correct. In terms I understand, I can use my MX850 RF remote to send commands to my MRF300 RF base station/IR repeater, which converts the signal into IR to my USB-UIRT, which CQC sees. Then, CQC sends a connection to the 8870 via the 8811 connection above to do whatever I want.

 

[68sting]

I have the Camstat and like it with the exception of the beap it makes every time it receives a command. I also have the same problem with the upstairs, main and basment being different temps. I set up an event in Homseer to run the fan for 10min every hour to help ciculate the air in the house. This has really worked well at keeping the house a consistant temp.. If you can run a wire you're probably better buying a hardwired unit. Not that there's anything wrong with the Camstat I'm just guessing your paying for the limited availablity of the newer technology.

 

[jarcher]

I have the Camstat and like it with the exception of the beap it makes every time it receives a command. I also have the same problem with the upstairs, main and basment being different temps. I set up an event in Homseer to run the fan for 10min every hour to help ciculate the air in the house. This has really worked well at keeping the house a consistant temp.. If you can run a wire you're probably better buying a hardwired unit. Not that there's anything wrong with the Camstat I'm just guessing your paying for the limited availablity of the newer technology.

Where do you have your fan installed? I was thinking of putting one into the attic to try and move the hot air out, thinking that might cool the upstairs a bit.

Currently, until 8:00AM Friday morning, I have an interior wall in the living room opened on one side. We're putting pocket doors in. So, this provides an opportunity to add some wiring between the basement and the attic (the upstairs wall is still closed but that's easy to get through). I am thinking of pulling 2 runs of 12/2 from the circuit box to the attic, just for future use (maybe a heated fan in the bathroom and an exhaust fan int eh attic) and also, if I amle, installing some electrical conduit for low voltage wiring.

The conduit could go from basement to attic, so I'll be able to add cat 5e, audio, video and other cables as needed.

Those 1-wire temp sensors look pretty interesting too. I was thinking of putting one on the ceiling of each room, just because it might be fun to monitor the temp differences. Maybe some HA software could then control the fan(s) and balance it out.

 

[68sting]

I have been working at this problem for a while now. The fan I kick on is the furnace fan. It just circulates the cold basment air, normal main level air, and warmer uperlevel air together to make the house a consistant temp.. I do have an attic fan also with thermostat set at 80. That didn't seem to help a lot. I then added a larger cold air return in the basment to suck more cold air out of the basment. That helped a lot. When I ran the vents for the family room in the basement I made them two way. In the summer I shut the vents from below and open the vents from above and that doubled my vents in the upstairs family room. I also put in some inline booster fans to the kids rooms that are on the second story . These are loud and I don't know how much they helped. I bult a coverd porch off the kithen and that keeps the sun out of the kitchen now. Finally we just had some windows tinted. That seems to be working very nice so far. We haven't had any really hot days yet though.

 

[68sting]

I forgot to add I also ran a 12/2 to the attic. Right now it runs a Christmas outlet and my flood lights. I have run lots of wires in the attic to the point my insulation is beaten down in the middle. I'm sure blowing in some more isulation would not hurt my situation but unitl I'm done working up there it will have to wait. I hooked the attic fan up to a switch in my sons room. That way I can shut it off in the winter and take advantage of the air heating up the attic on nice days.

 

[jarcher]

Well it looks like I am not going to have time to decide on a thermostat before my walls get closed up on Friday. From looking at all the options, I se that some, even the wireless ones, need wires. It seems that the ones with "remote sensors" need to have these remote sensors wired to the main thermostat, while others need some kind of wiring from the thermostat control to some other gizmo.

So, what do you guys recomend I run for wiring, so I'm not limited by that later on? I want to be able to use practically any thermostat I later choose with remote sensors. So what wiring should I lay to make sure that can happen?

Thanks again...

Jim

 

[eufreka]

Well it looks like I am not going to have time to decide on a thermostat before my walls get closed up on Friday. From looking at all the options, I se that some, even the wireless ones, need wires. It seems that the ones with "remote sensors" need to have these remote sensors wired to the main thermostat, while others need some kind of wiring from the thermostat control to some other gizmo.

So, what do you guys recomend I run for wiring, so I'm not limited by that later on? I want to be able to use practically any thermostat I later choose with remote sensors. So what wiring should I lay to make sure that can happen?

Thanks again...

Jim

what's wrong with just spec'ing a low voltage box at each thermostat location...run a length of conduit for those that will have access issues...heck do conduit on all of them regardless...how many are you talking about?