About to choose a protocol, controller, and switches... zwave?

[rocketmonkeys]

Hey all.  I've got the house nearly built, wiring is all there, now I have to figure out the controller, protocol, and especially lighting switches.  I'm going nuts since I have to make some decisions quickly, and I've got so much else going on.  Right now, I need to choose the light switches, but that also means I have to choose some things like the controller, protocol, etc.
 
Here's my plan so far:
-Protocol: Zwave or UPB, probably Zwave.  I need to have a wireless lock, so that implies zwave.  Zwave light switches seem cheaper (thought maybe not for LED dimmers).
-Lights: lots of recessed Cree LED lights from Home Depot.
-6 On/off light switches
-6 Dimmer light switches
-Most of the switches will be 3-way, so additional aux-switches as well
-Wireless deadbolt (kwikset zwave?)
-Controller: USB dongle + custom software?
 
Later, motorized blinds (all hardwired), webcams (hardwire cat5e), maybe motion detectors, smoke/fire alarm relays, various sensors (cat5e), garage doors.
 
For the controller, ideally I'd love to be able to write some custom software on my linux home-server to run all of this.  Maybe that's a little too ambitious.  I do have an ubuntu home-server that I planned for this purpose.  I wonder if I could get a USB zwave interface, use an existing library to handle the protocol (open-zwave, etc), and write my own code (or extend something like pytomation).
 
For light switches, it's taking a bit of research to find good/available/reliable switches.  The on/off ones seem easier.  The dimmers seem hard.  Looks like evolve dimmers work well w/ LED lights & they're cheap ($50 vs. the Leviton VRE06's $220 price tag).
 
Some questions I'm researching now:
- Should I choose something else (UPB/zigbee) over zwave?
- Will I be able to do USB dongle + custom/cheap software for a controller, or will I have to get a hardware (mi casa verde) or software (homeseer) commercial product?
- Are the evolves the best choice for zwave dimmers + 3-way + LED lights?
 
Any advice you guys can give would be helpful.  I'm trying to research this on my own (which is how I've gotten to this point), but there's quite a lot of info to go through and I'm going to be making some choices fairly quickly.
 
Thanks!

 

[drvnbysound]

I with with Zwave for one of the reasons that you mentioned above... I wanted a controllable deadbolt (and didn't want to have to build a Zwave network just for the locks).
 
I would take a look at this comparison guide at least as a starting point:
http://store.homeseer.com/store/HomeSeer-Z-Wave-Wall-Switch-Matrix-W7C37.aspx
 
I missed the boat on the "Supports Instant Status" when I was purchasing mine... I thought this was a standard feature at the time. Mine don't support this, but they do support Beaming (for the locks).
 
That said, I am currently using my Elk panel to control my Zwave network. I wouldn't suggest writing your own code unless you want that to be a stand-alone hobby of yours. There are so many other products available that already do a good job of this; no reason to reinvent the wheel.

 

[JimS]

If you are wanting to do this with linux one option is misterhouse:
 
http://misterhouse.wikispaces.com/
 
I think there were a couple ways people connected to zwave.  Some used the mi casa verde.

 

[rocketmonkeys]

I with with Zwave for one of the reasons that you mentioned above... I wanted a controllable deadbolt (and didn't want to have to build a Zwave network just for the locks).
 
I would take a look at this comparison guide at least as a starting point:
http://store.homeseer.com/store/HomeSeer-Z-Wave-Wall-Switch-Matrix-W7C37.aspx
 
I missed the boat on the "Supports Instant Status" when I was purchasing mine... I thought this was a standard feature at the time. Mine don't support this, but they do support Beaming (for the locks).
 
That said, I am currently using my Elk panel to control my Zwave network. I wouldn't suggest writing your own code unless you want that to be a stand-alone hobby of yours. There are so many other products available that already do a good job of this; no reason to reinvent the wheel.

 
Thanks for that link, that's a really nice chart.  I wish they had a similar one for dimmers.  I'm making a chart of my own, but it's hard to consolidate all the info.
 
Instant status - this means that when a switch is activated locally, it'll immediately tell the controller that it changed, right?  If the switch doesn't have that, you have to wait for a poll?
 
Re: writing my own - I do want some software I can run from linux / ubuntu, since I want to consolidate most of my HA into one box.  I'll probably start w/ one of the cheap/free/open-source linux packages, and if that doesn't work then I'll do my own.
 
Is there any comparison chart of dimmers?  There's also a lot of switches not on that page (Cooper RF9534, Evolve LRM-AS / LRM-15, Jasco 45610, 45612, Leviton VRE06, VRMX1, VRM10, VRI06, VRI10).
 
Thanks again.

 

[srodgers]

Here is a good comparison chart from the HomeSeer site.

http://store.homeseer.com/store/HomeSeer-Z-Wave-Wall-Switch-Matrix-W7C37.aspx

 

[drvnbysound]

Thanks for that link, that's a really nice chart.  I wish they had a similar one for dimmers.  I'm making a chart of my own, but it's hard to consolidate all the info.

 
You mean this? http://store.homeseer.com/store/HomeSeer-Z-Wave-Dimming-Wall-Switch-Comparison-W16C64.aspx
 

Instant status - this means that when a switch is activated locally, it'll immediately tell the controller that it changed, right?  If the switch doesn't have that, you have to wait for a poll?

 
Yes. I avoid polling because of my deadbolt really. I don't want my network constantly polling all day long and it reducing the battery life (or me having to replace it that much more often just because I'm constantly polling).
 

Re: writing my own - I do want some software I can run from linux / ubuntu, since I want to consolidate most of my HA into one box.  I'll probably start w/ one of the cheap/free/open-source linux packages, and if that doesn't work then I'll do my own.

No real comment for the above as I currently use the Elk. I do have a license for CQC but have yet to need it for anything that I've wanted to do.
 

Is there any comparison chart of dimmers?  There's also a lot of switches not on that page (Cooper RF9534, Evolve LRM-AS / LRM-15, Jasco 45610, 45612, Leviton VRE06, VRMX1, VRM10, VRI06, VRI10).
 
Thanks again.

See above.

 

[jaymartin]

You won't be able to roll-your-own software and control Z-Wave locks. That part of the API is very closely guarded and requires $$ and onerous certification requirements to get. So you'll need to go with a commercial solution that has implemented lock support.

 

[Automate]

You won't be able to roll-your-own software and control Z-Wave locks. That part of the API is very closely guarded and requires $$ and onerous certification requirements to get. So you'll need to go with a commercial solution that has implemented lock support.

Premise can with open source http://cocoontech.com/forums/files/file/176-vrc0p-z-wave-module-for-premise/

 

[az1324]

You won't be able to roll-your-own software and control Z-Wave locks. That part of the API is very closely guarded and requires $$ and onerous certification requirements to get. So you'll need to go with a commercial solution that has implemented lock support.

Leviton VRC0P interface supports locks right?

 

[Automate]

Leviton VRC0P interface supports locks right?

Yes, see my post above.  The Aeon Labs USB Z-stick also supports locks but not with Open-Zwave.

 

[swaggy]

You won't be able to roll-your-own software and control Z-Wave locks. That part of the API is very closely guarded and requires $$ and onerous certification requirements to get. So you'll need to go with a commercial solution that has implemented lock support.

Check out:
http://sourceforge.net/projects/vrc0p/

It's not exactly roll-your-own but probably as close as you can get without buying an expensive hardware based controller (still need a Leviton VRC0P). I can send you a patch that adds basic lock support.

 

[rocketmonkeys]

You mean this? http://store.homeseer.com/store/HomeSeer-Z-Wave-Dimming-Wall-Switch-Comparison-W16C64.aspx
 
 
Yes. I avoid polling because of my deadbolt really. I don't want my network constantly polling all day long and it reducing the battery life (or me having to replace it that much more often just because I'm constantly polling).
 
No real comment for the above as I currently use the Elk. I do have a license for CQC but have yet to need it for anything that I've wanted to do.
 
See above.

 
That's great!  That had most of the dimmers that were already on my list; very helpful.
 
 

You won't be able to roll-your-own software and control Z-Wave locks. That part of the API is very closely guarded and requires $$ and onerous certification requirements to get. So you'll need to go with a commercial solution that has implemented lock support.

 
 

Premise can with open source http://cocoontech.com/forums/files/file/176-vrc0p-z-wave-module-for-premise/

 
 

Leviton VRC0P interface supports locks right?

 
 

Yes, see my post above.  The Aeon Labs USB Z-stick also supports locks but not with Open-Zwave.

 
 
Thanks for the feedback on those things.  I hadn't spent much time looking at the controller end of things, but I think now that's a big consideration for me.  I really want to be able to customize & control things.  I'd like to tie in some custom sensors, use notifications, tie in a DIY webcam-based motion detection system to send my phone picture messages, etc.  Just lots of random little projects.  I'd like to keep costs down.  It sounds nice to be able to buy a simple hardware controller (mi casa verde, etc) and customize it.  But I wonder if I give up a lot of flexibility then.
 
So I'm starting to backtrack a bit.  First - I need to get switches now, it's holding up the project.  Second - I'm not at all sure which direction I want to go in.  For HA, I want to do 1) lights, 2) dimmers, 3) thermostats, 4) locks. The locks need to be wireless.  The rest can be wired.
 
From what little I've read so far, seems like UPB is a better choice for me.  Two of the wireless dimmers will be located on the 2nd floor, a ways away from the controller/other nodes.  Also, one of the thermostats would be located fairly far away from the others, above the garage.  I wonder if wired UPB would be better than zwave in this case.
 
I think I'd rather read up more on which system I'd rather have, then do the whole install from there.  I'm going to tell the electrician to do a full install w/ normal switches, then when I've got things laid out I'll replace the switches one by one as needed.  I'd rather not rush a decision, hold up my project, and end up with something not ideal.
 
 

Check out:
http://sourceforge.net/projects/vrc0p/

It's not exactly roll-your-own but probably as close as you can get without buying an expensive hardware based controller (still need a Leviton VRC0P). I can send you a patch that adds basic lock support.

 
Pretty cool.  That's a secondary controller, so I'd still need a primary, right?  Can the VRC0P work as a primary controller using linux based software?

 

[swaggy]

 
Pretty cool.  That's a secondary controller, so I'd still need a primary, right?  Can the VRC0P work as a primary controller using linux based software?

Yes, you still need a primary controller. I used the Leviton VRUSB to enroll devices into my network and the VRC0P for control. Works well. The VRC0P is a secondary but once you enroll your devices, you can use it with Linux to control your network.

 

[rocketmonkeys]

Yes, you still need a primary controller. I used the Leviton VRUSB to enroll devices into my network and the VRC0P for control. Works well. The VRC0P is a secondary but once you enroll your devices, you can use it with Linux to control your network.

 
Very neat.  So does this mean that the VRUSB is simply for connecting & enrollment (ie. installing / reconfiguring devices), then day to day the VRC0P controls everything?  What software do you use with your VRC0P?
 
If you wanted to, could you have used the VRC0P w/ a laptop to do enrollment too?  Could you have used something like a Aeon Z-Stick to do double duty (ie. move around to do enrollment, then plug into PC to do control)?
 
Thanks for the info, still figuring this all out.

 

[drvnbysound]

Very neat.  So does this mean that the VRUSB is simply for connecting & enrollment (ie. installing / reconfiguring devices), then day to day the VRC0P controls everything?  What software do you use with your VRC0P?
 
If you wanted to, could you have used the VRC0P w/ a laptop to do enrollment too?  Could you have used something like a Aeon Z-Stick to do double duty (ie. move around to do enrollment, then plug into PC to do control)?
 
Thanks for the info, still figuring this all out.

The VRUSB comes with the Installer Tool software; it's downloaded from the Leviton website.