Simply Automated 3 Way Hook Up

[shane94]

I have begun swapping over the light switches in my new home to the Simply Automated ones. So far I have only changed over standard 2 way switches. Pretty cut and dry for those Those install quickly and easily. Today tried my first 3 way...not so easy. I am using these 2 switches:

US2-40
Remote 1 Slot
Remote 2 Slot
Black
White
Brown

USR dummy
Brown
White
White/Red
brown/white

I am dealing with a 3way that is in a hall. Thier are 2 lights between the 3 way. I know which is the main switch and which is the secondary. I have a bundle of whites 2 blacks and a red. Here is how the current standard switches are ran:



On switch 1 i assume that the red is the travler. I know which black is the hot and which is the load. One the dummy no matter how i hook it up they just wont work. both switches light up but will not opperate the lights. Any insight or help is much appreciated cause this is driving me crazy.

Thanks
Shane

 

[shane94]

blah wont let me post a link yet Been a noobie is hard sometimes




switch 1
bottom left = red wire
top right = black (goes to light gold screw)
right bottom = black (is the hot)

Switch 2
left bottom = black
right top = red
right bottom = black

 

[pete_c]

I am also just starting to switch over to UPB installing first in all of the hallways in the home. Two hallways have single switches but one has three. It looks like there's two ways to set up three way switches. One is using the traveler wires between the switches and the other one is just to link the switches virtually. Personally since the travelers are in the boxes will utilize these. I have numerous three ways thruout the home. (IE: main foyer chandelier has 3 switches, kitchen cans have two, garage outside has 2, etc).

Historically in my home the electrician has used black and white. Red or orange going to the light and blue as a traveler. But reviewing also noticed that the electrical also has used other colors for the traveler. Using a meter you can check which ones are the load and traveling but you have to be very careful. Take your time and check your wires with a meter before you put your switches in.

I have a white (neutral), black (hot), orange or red (load), blue or ?(traveler) in each box. Before testing with meter you should be able to see what leads went to what terminals on the switch.

 

[ano]

You can wire the three-way both of the ways you describe, but I will warn you, having been there, using remote switches isn't a good solution. The remotes don't look and feel like a regular switch, the lights don't match regular switches and the resulting switch seems to not work as well as the main switch. You will be sorry if you go that route.

Instead, rewire the traveler so that you can supply power to three-way switches other than the one that control the light directly, then install regular switches in these boxes. Its SO much more flexible, but it does cost a bit more also.

Of course I'm sure you don't believe me so I recommend you wire up a remote switch yourself and try it, and I'm sure you will come to the same conclusion I did.

 

[pete_c]

Ano,

So setting up virtuals using standard UPB switches versus UPB and Remote is your recommendation?

 

[AutomatedOutlet]

That's what I normally do. It also gives you the opportunity to put a keypad in there.

 

[pete_c]

I followed a similiar methodology with the three ways for the Insteon switches. As with the hallways in the home I have three way switches (currently Insteon) all over the home. Keypads will work well in the kitchen.

 

[ano]

Yes, if you just use links, really any switch in your house can be a virtual 3-way switch for any other switch. I think Simply Automated makes a switch that can send links but not operate a load, but its hard to find and probably not much cheaper anyway, so I'd just use a regular switch and put a cap on the load wire since its not controlling a load in those 3-way locations. (For a 3-way, the switch on one side WILL actually control the load, but the switch on the other side won't.) The speed is almost instant, so in my house, I've lost track of which switch is "real" and which switch is "virtual."

 

[Event5]

Here is a link to a diagram I got from Simply Automated. It shows both the standard 3 way and virtual 3 way wiring. Hope it helps.

Dave

Ok, Link should be ok now

 

[tmbrown97]

I've heard this theory of not really using the remote switches before... I can say from my end, the only thing that bothers me is that the light doesn't follow the same pattern (it's green not blue, and can only be on when the light is on) - otherwise, to me they're fine. They feel the same to me. In one spot I had to do the "virtual" 3-way, and that's the one switch that doesn't correctly report status back to the M1. I guess it depends on how anal you are, and what you're anal about.

For me, I'm cheap and I want accurate status... and I have no desire whatsoever to replace with keypads later. That said, I also bought 240's for flexibility, but now seeing how they're programmed differently - i'll stick with the 1140's unless I know I want the split rockers or keypads at some point.

 

[pete_c]

Relating to LED status I guess I am not too fussy about what I see; more about what status shows up remotely. IE: remotely sometimes will dial into my network, confirm events and status then look at my cameras to validate. Would be great is a switch would also give status of load. IE: time to change a bulb. (someday soon hopefully). Would be great to look at your powerline network and not only see status but see power utilization of the loads.

I currently have a variety of styles of Insteon (with different color LEDs and grades of LED bars). There are switches that I rarely touch anymore (outside lights) and switches that I use manually every day.

 

[ano]

Relating to LED status I guess I am not too fussy about what I see; more about what status shows up remotely. IE: remotely sometimes will dial into my network, confirm events and status then look at my cameras to validate. Would be great is a switch would also give status of load. IE: time to change a bulb. (someday soon hopefully). Would be great to look at your powerline network and not only see status but see power utilization of the loads.

I currently have a variety of styles of Insteon (with different color LEDs and grades of LED bars). There are switches that I rarely touch anymore (outside lights) and switches that I use manually every day.

If you set it all up correctly, using a switch as a remote, it should report on/off correctly, and the LED should mirror that of the load. Its a bit tricky, but basically both switches have to link back to each other. If your real switch links back to your virtual switch, it will turn on or off its LED. In addition, all external links that act on the real switch need to act on the virtual switch. With remote switches, their LED will never match the real switch.

Would be great to look at your powerline network and not only see status but see power utilization of the loads.

There are a new type of Zigbee switches that do just that. They not only report on and off but how much power they are using.

 

[pete_c]

So will be using regular UBP switches instead of remote UPB switches.

Interesting news about Zigbee's power reads.

 

[shane94]

ok guys did away with the dummy switches and got all US2-40 switches.

I hooked it up like Event5 diagram (cannot link back to is becuase i do not have enough post..see post#9)

The virtual switch blue/green led comes on and it does not opperate the light. (think you need to set up a link)
The master switch blue/green led come on and it DOES opperate the light.

So now what i think i need to do to finish this set up off is to create a link. I have tried for 3 hours now with no luck. Anyone have any advise on how to set these up? First one is always the hardest hehe.

Thanks

 

[shane94]

and 4 hours later we got it LOL. did not have options->transmit checked once i did that it was good to go. I so can't wait until i get to the lights with 3 and 4 switches hehe