LED doorbell push button for the M1 GOLD

[apostolakisl]

Per the OP, this was the one I purchased on amazon... Led does not light up, but push button does triggers a closed/ non closed contact, creating an event in the m1

Is it because the. Led on this button require too much power?

http://www.amazon.co...4850854&sr=8-12

Are you running the led off of an elk zone? If so that is dc current and led's most have the polarity correct to work. Perhaps you just need to flip the led around. Elk zones put out around 7ma or so if memory serves me which should light up most led bulbs. I have a bunch of 12v led bulbs like this one http://www.ebay.com/itm/5mm-Yellow-12-24-VAC-DC-LED-PreWired-leads-10pcs-/260832599765?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3cbad59ed5 and the Elk lights them up nice and bright.

Also, check the voltage of the Elk zone. If it is 13v when not pushing the button, then the no current is flowing through the bulb. This would likely indicate backward polarity or a bad led.

 

[treo650]

@lou

Yeah, tried flip flopping the polarity... No lights unfortunately

 

[treo650]

Oh and yes, wiring push button directly to the zone

 

[apostolakisl]

@lou

Yeah, tried flip flopping the polarity... No lights unfortunately

Did you check the zone voltage.

With the bulb removed (nothing connected to the bulb contacts), the zone voltage should read in the mid to upper 13's on the Elk and if you put a volt meter where the bulb connects, you should get the same(ish) volts.
With the bulb removed, short the two contacts to the bulb. Voltage on elk should read 0 or just above 0.
With the bulb properly installed, it should read somewhere between 0 and 13, depends on the resistance of the bulb. But the basic jist is, if the voltage doesn't drop, there is no current which points to a bad bulb.

 

[treo650]

I was told that the doorbell button is rated at 16VAC, thats probably why it does not ligjt up?

anyhow,

do you guys think this button will work?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1pc-Angel-Eye-RED-Led-12mm-12V-Metal-Switch-Momentary-Push-Button-/300691433157?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item46029b26c5

I plan to take it and use it in a doorbell housing

 

[apostolakisl]

I was told that the doorbell button is rated at 16VAC, thats probably why it does not ligjt up?

anyhow,

do you guys think this button will work?

http://www.ebay.com/...=item46029b26c5

I plan to take it and use it in a doorbell housing

Yes, I do believe that would work. It's pretty cool looking too.

But I thought you said you replaced the doorbell's light bulb with an led. Assuming it is just a doorbell and doesn't have any intercom function or other stuff, then the 16vac rating is a condition of the bulb and by replacing the bulb you would be elliminating that specification.

 

[treo650]

Thanks for replying Lou,

The previous doorbell from Amazon, 16VAC has a built in ring led with the button.. (similar to the button from ebay)

So in essence its replace all, not just the bulb.

At this point nothing has been ordered, the previous unit was returned to amazon because it didn't light up.

I'm starting fresh, so hopefully that ebay push button will work

 

[apostolakisl]

Thanks for replying Lou,

The previous doorbell from Amazon, 16VAC has a built in ring led with the button.. (similar to the button from ebay)

So in essence its replace all, not just the bulb.

At this point nothing has been ordered, the previous unit was returned to amazon because it didn't light up.

I'm starting fresh, so hopefully that ebay push button will work

Well if the other unit was designed for 16vac then it had mechanisms inside of it to make that compatible with that led. So you can't just wire it up without removing other diodes/resistors and replacing with items compaitble with 13vdc.

I do have some concern that the ebay item will not hold up to the outdoor conditions. While it has the look of stainless, it is probably not and it may start looking like crappola in a year or so.

The one you are looking at on ebay has a 510ohm resistor in it. You probably will need to remove that resistor. Elk has a built in resistor on each zone that is around 2000 ohms. It is possible the ebay led will not get enough current or it may just be a bit dimmer.

 

[wuench]

I have my doorbell connected directly to a zone (although not LED, it's non-lighted). Some things to consider are, you should make sure to connect it to zones 1-16, not a zone expander. Also you will need to crank down your zone loop response settings. These steps are necessary to reduce the delay in the M1 detecting the button press. Even with that I do have times where people press the button too fast and the press isn't detected by the M1. So YMMV.

These are the settings I settled on:
Globals..G06-G10 Zones... Fast Loop Response = 20ms
On Zone you connected doorbell to check Fast Loop Response

 

[treo650]

I'm thinking of ordering this one, for the white color led

http://www.ebay.com/itm/12V-Metal-Switch-Momentary-Push-Button-White-Led-12mm-R-/251041323248?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3a733a98f0#ht_6243wt_766

Do you know if I need a different resistor? Is so, which ohm?

The stainless definitely looks cheap, and not galvanized, so you raise a valid concern.

I plan on using this small led12mm button into a real oil bronze doorbell housing frame, so hopefully if it does rust, it doesn't show too much. --as long as the button still lights, I think I will be okay

@wuench, thanks for the reply. Yes I remember reading your posts a few months back about loop response, so I noted that.

 

[apostolakisl]

I'm thinking of ordering this one, for the white color led

http://www.ebay.com/...0#ht_6243wt_766

Do you know if I need a different resistor? Is so, which ohm?

The stainless definitely looks cheap, and not galvanized, so you raise a valid concern.

I plan on using this small led12mm button into a real oil bronze doorbell housing frame, so hopefully if it does rust, it doesn't show too much. --as long as the button still lights, I think I will be okay

@wuench, thanks for the reply. Yes I remember reading your posts a few months back about loop response, so I noted that.

Probably you will not need a resistor at all. Like I said, Elk has a resistor on every zone, that is why you can short a zone and not fry the elk. It is also why a 2200 ohm resistor drops the voltage from 13.8 to 7.4 at the point of measurement (which is after the built in resistor). Elk zones at most put out something like 7ma when the zone is shorted. With an eol resistor it drops to like 3ma.

 

[pete_c]

I like the Ebay 12VDC button mentioned above.

I currently utilize the Elk doorbell board and Elk debounce board and pass 20VAC to the doorbell.

What would be the recommended tweak to illuminate the above Ebay mentioned 12VDC doorbell button with 20VAC?

 

[apostolakisl]

This much I can tell you for absolute certain.

The following LED lights work with no modifications connected directly to Elk zones.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/F-10-x-5mm-Mixed-Colour-LEDs-Pre-Wired-Light-Lamp-12V-/160787155930?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item256fa94bda

I have them and they work perfectly.

 

[pete_c]

Lou,

What will I need to do with the 12VDC LED halo doorbell button mentioned above to work with the 20VAC doorbell power supply.

I've read the dual LED / resistor FAQ mentioned earlier.

Would this work and would changing the polarity of the methodology give me light when not pressed and off light when pressed?

What would I have to do to have the halo style LED 12VDC button always illuminated?

I have little space to work with as I carved a section of my door to fit the doorbell button flush.

 

[apostolakisl]

Lou,

What will I need to do with the 12VDC LED halo doorbell button mentioned above to work with the 20VAC doorbell power supply.

I've read the dual LED / resistor FAQ mentioned earlier.

Would this work and would changing the polarity of the methodology give me light when not pressed and off light when pressed?

What would I have to do to have the halo style LED 12VDC button always illuminated?

I have little space to work with as I carved a section of my door to fit the doorbell button flush.

Pushing the button bypasses the bulb no matter what type it is sending power to the chime. I suppose it is possible that there is a button out there that works different, but I doubt it.

The thing that is your issue is that you can't mess with the 20vac or the chime won't ring. When you push the button, you need 20vac to bypass the light and go to the chime. The doorbell button is just an on/off switch that while depressed turns the chime on by shunting power past the bulb to it. So you can't put any diodes or resistors unless you can somehow get them in between the where the power branches off from the button contacts and the button's led. Odds are, that this will not be possible since I would expect that there would be no way to access that area without destroying the button and even if you could get to it there would probably be no room to put anything.

So, in short, you can try the 20vac and it may not damage the bulb and it may work just fine as is. Or the, led burns out and you have a non-glowing button. I'm afraid there is no sure fire way to know by just reading the button description.