Assistance w/replacing older Brinks with new DIY installation?

Home was built about 10 years ago and Brinks installed their own "wired" security system with sensors located on doors and windows on first floor, one motion detector, and a smoke detector.  I cancelled the service with them roughly about 3 or 4 years ago and now I would like to incorporate a home security system back into my "security layering" (already have ip cams) just for an additional peace of mind.  It appears with these factory installed systems they cannot be used as standalone monitoring due most likely to proprietary measures set up by the installer / company I am assuming.
 
I would like to install a new control module / box unit and just use existing wiring / sensors if possible.  I don't necessarily want the "monitoring" aspect of it (with another company) and would want it to notify me of an alert via cellular if I were away from home.  Everything the way it is would work other than adding in one more motion sensor in my basement area.
 
I will admit I am a newb as it relates to home security / automation but am "fairly" technical and wouldn't mind taking on a DIY project if those that are in the know on this forum believe it to be possible?  Can anyone recommend me a system, a good starting point and answer some questions along the way for completing this project or am I barking up the wrong tree and this should not be attempted?
 
Thanks for any feedback that you can provide!
 
 

Brinks had essentially 2 panels. Either a proprietary Scantronic or proprietary Honeywell. Most likely you have the honeywell.
 
The largest item is budget and how much information you truly want to get. If you just want to know alarm went off, you can just get something like a Vista 20P (reuse existing can and replace the can door, replace keypads and then get a "dumb" voice dialer.
 
The control and keypad would need to be replaced. Peripherals vary slightly.

DEL-
 
Thanks for your response...I have been a lurker for awhile and even read a few threads pertaining to this subject and saw where you answered quite a few questions and if I'm not mistaken you even mentioned that you install security systems for a living?  Anyway, it's great to have someone like yourself who is knowledgeable on the subject and provide detailed guidance  http://cocoontech.com/forums/topic/26139-incorporating-older-adt-sensors-into-new-diy-security-sys/
 
First things first...I will attach some pics of my current alarm panel just so we can attempt to decipher what we are dealing with:
 

 
Also while digging around inside the panel I found some documentation that appears to be some sort of wire "key" for all the different sensors...this may come in handy when attempting to install the new one...I believe?
 

 
Now onto your response...my budget is really anything to get this accomplished.  Let's just say my wife and I are feeling a little on the "uneasy" side these days due to some recent reported break-in's / home invasions in our local area.  So with that in mind...I don't really want to spend 1K on this alarm system but if it takes 500 or so to get things done the way we want it then so be it.
 
It's funny that you mentioned the Vista 20P because I was just looking and reading reviews about that same setup on amazon yesterday.  I read a lot of comments where people have replaced their old ADT / Brinks systems with this and it was working well.  I also read a lot of comments where people felt like you need to have a software engineer background / experience to program once the install was completed which is a little disheartening.
 
You mention that I can reuse the can...so I am assuming that is the tan alarm box hanging on the stud but not the door?  Will the door not fit or close any longer or something for whatever reason?  I also have been reading where you typically need to replace keypads, motions, and siren's.  I see this Vista 20P also makes an RF keypad which I am assuming assists with someone adding wireless peripherals to the system maybe?  I am also not sure what you mean by "dumb" voice dialer....is it possible to have this connected to the net so it will email me or alert me somehow that the alarm is going off if I am away from the house?
 
So with all this being said and the pictures attached...I am ready for next steps if you can offer some advice?  Should we start listing specific part numbers / descriptions to purchase or something else?
 
Thanks again and look forward to hearing back from you!

 

The budget is going to be the killer.
 
Pro alarm hardware is designed for monitoring. No way around it. If you wanted to get a 3rd party product for self-monitoring, there's a few out there.
 
The 20P is pretty easy to program. The issue people have is they expect the manuals and documents to be a comprehensive "how to" of programming and installation methods.They're not. Requisite time reading through and spending time with the panel is what needs to be done. Don't expect the panel to connect directly to your laptop without a modem or other hardware. Just the nature of the beast, you're buying into a pricepoint.
 
You would change the door so the schematic matches the board installed in the can, no other purpose. You could then use the can you get with the replacement panel for the expanders.
 
You're not going to need to replace anything but the keypad(s) and board. Maybe add a siren driver if you have speakers installed (can't remember what BHS used)
 
I'd buy a 20P, a couple of 4219's and whatever 3rd party device you choose to get the thing on the net for your self monitoring (personally not a fan). I wouldn't buy a KP with a built in receiver. If you need it, they ran a cable to your closet already. Get a larger battery and call it a day. (maybe an aux supply, calcs needed).

~10 years ago I looked at adding on my existing builder quality Napco system and ended up replacing it with an Elk M1G. I was able to re-use all the existing hardwired sensors. Napco at the time did not offer any modules to make it easy to interface over a LAN and even if they did I had to have it professionally installed or be a licensed dealer. The Elk (and the ISY Insteon interface) were the best investment. I can control my whole house from across the world and even from 35,000 ft in the air. I did it once just to prove I could, and one other time in a pub to show off to some dude who thought a BB was better than an iPhone.

DELInstallations said:

The budget is going to be the killer.
 
Pro alarm hardware is designed for monitoring. No way around it. If you wanted to get a 3rd party product for self-monitoring, there's a few out there.
 
The 20P is pretty easy to program. The issue people have is they expect the manuals and documents to be a comprehensive "how to" of programming and installation methods.They're not. Requisite time reading through and spending time with the panel is what needs to be done. Don't expect the panel to connect directly to your laptop without a modem or other hardware. Just the nature of the beast, you're buying into a pricepoint.
 
You would change the door so the schematic matches the board installed in the can, no other purpose. You could then use the can you get with the replacement panel for the expanders.
 
You're not going to need to replace anything but the keypad(s) and board. Maybe add a siren driver if you have speakers installed (can't remember what BHS used)
 
I'd buy a 20P, a couple of 4219's and whatever 3rd party device you choose to get the thing on the net for your self monitoring (personally not a fan). I wouldn't buy a KP with a built in receiver. If you need it, they ran a cable to your closet already. Get a larger battery and call it a day. (maybe an aux supply, calcs needed).

Click to expand...

DEL-
 
Thanks again for the reply....I am not "firm" on the budget so in your professional experience if you have another opinion I am certainly open to discussion?  For example, if you think something like a HAI or ELK, etc would be a better fit, longer term solution I am all for it.  I have little to no experience in this arena so I am shooting in the dark.
 
Good to know about the programming aspect of the 20P.  I will attempt to read and re-read instructions several times as well as watch some online videos (YouTube).
 
Now I understand why I would change the door.  Thanks for the clarification.
 
What would the 4219 be for....?  Is that a wired zone expander....so I can add more zones if necessary?  I was going to say that I forgot about a bonus room area that currently is not alarmed at the present time that we are planning on finishing and I would like to have that added to the system so I may need another zone or two.  I also have some upstairs windows that are not wired (only first floor was pre-wired when installed) that I would like to add sensors to.  I assume I would need to get wireless sensors for those...just not sure how the wireless integrates into this system.
 
Also, I checked amazon and it looks like they have the 20P as a "self-monitoring" kit which I guess includes this 3rd party device built into the board to send notifications and allows control over the net?
 
Thanks.... 

elvisimprsntr said:

~10 years ago I looked at adding on my existing builder quality Napco system and ended up replacing it with an Elk M1G. I was able to re-use all the existing hardwired sensors. Napco at the time did not offer any modules to make it easy to interface over a LAN and even if they did I had to have it professionally installed or be a licensed dealer. The Elk (and the ISY Insteon interface) were the best investment. I can control my whole house from across the world and even from 35,000 ft in the air. I did it once just to prove I could, and one other time in a pub to show off to some dude who thought a BB was better than an iPhone.

Click to expand...

Thx for the information regarding the Elk system.  I am a novice in this area so I am not sure what system(s) will integrate into my current setup (sensors, detectors, etc).  The insteon interface is a nice touch for the home automation aspect although I was leaning more towards z-wave when I finally go down the HA road

If you are going to want to add home automation eventually, I would make the investment now in an Elk or Omni Pro II.  The Vista can do some automation functions, but is much more limited and you will probably end up replacing it in the long run.
 
The self monitoring function for the Vista 20P that you see on Amazon is an add-on board from EnvisaLink.
 
In most cases, you can re-use wired window and door sensors and motion detectors with any panel, no problem.  Wireless sensors are a different story and need to have a compatible receiver on the panel.  If your current system has 2-wire smoke detectors, you may need to replace them depending on what panel you go with.  Not a big deal, as they are relatively inexpensive.
 
If you go with the Vista system, you will need one or more 4219 zone expanders to match the number of zones you have.  How many you need depends on whether you want every sensor on its own zone, or whether you are willing to daisy chain several sensors into a single zone (say all windows in each room as a zone).  You would need zone expanders for the Elk or Omni Pro II as well.
 
One thing to consider about self monitoring vs central station monitoring - you can usually get a significant discount on your homeowner's insurance if you have central station monitoring, and that will pretty much cover the cost of the monitoring.  AlarmRelay and NextAlarm are two companies that many people here use.  The cost is as low as $8.95 a month.  There are times and situations when self monitoring just doesn't work.

The big item is a 20P kit with 2 alpha keypads, expanders, a 7AH battery and all the modules to get the unit out to the outside world, even to interface to a 3rd party automation product for the same or less than an entry M1 and keypad kit. Would the M1 fit into a self monitoring profile with little additional hardware, sure, but you're paying for that flexibility, combined with any ethernet accessibility. The basic Vista 20P, keypad and battery can be had for the sub $250 range vs. $450 + $75 for the DBHR (which is very likely to be necessary) as the basic entry fee to get a 16 zone panel and equivalent battery.
 
Just the facts.
 
If the system was of any great size, had a bunch of peripherals, you'd see the costs align. A fully loaded 20P compared to a M1G, the costs are actually pretty close, but the capabilities are significantly different. There's ways to skin the cat with each and the level of integration or control can vary. You can do quite a bit with a V20P, it's just not as flexible as a M1. All that comes at a price.
 
I've installed hundreds of 20P's (actually the entire Vista line) over the years and quite a few M1's and EZ8's since they first came out. They're both capable panels and good build quality, but the M1 will always be significantly more expensive to install and get up and running part for part.

Another way to go is with something like a DSC system.  Basically another brand comparable to the Vista 20p (although probably slightly more expensive overall.)  But if you later want to home automate it, it integrates with the HAI/Leviton Lumina system, which is similar to having a Omni Pro II.  Advantage is you can just do the DSC now and integrate it with the automation system later if you like.

cobra said:

Another way to go is with something like a DSC system.  Basically another brand comparable to the Vista 20p (although probably slightly more expensive overall.)  But if you later want to home automate it, it integrates with the HAI/Leviton Lumina system, which is similar to having a Omni Pro II.  Advantage is you can just do the DSC now and integrate it with the automation system later if you like.

Click to expand...

From working with every manufacturer out there, DSC has had a bunch of build quality issues I wouldn't overlook. Same as their detectors. I would not steer someone towards them personally. Has always been a price point panel. Coming from someone that has installed and serviced them.
 
Not a very friendly panel to program either.....the hilarious part was each component came with the instructions to install it; the RF receiver data field instructions came with the RF receiver, not the panel itself, or the keypad alpha configuration came with the keypad. In order to figure out how to install and configure the panel, you had to buy all the components and then put the instructions together after unboxing the components.

RAL said:

If you are going to want to add home automation eventually, I would make the investment now in an Elk or Omni Pro II.  The Vista can do some automation functions, but is much more limited and you will probably end up replacing it in the long run.
 
The self monitoring function for the Vista 20P that you see on Amazon is an add-on board from EnvisaLink.
 
In most cases, you can re-use wired window and door sensors and motion detectors with any panel, no problem.  Wireless sensors are a different story and need to have a compatible receiver on the panel.  If your current system has 2-wire smoke detectors, you may need to replace them depending on what panel you go with.  Not a big deal, as they are relatively inexpensive.
 
If you go with the Vista system, you will need one or more 4219 zone expanders to match the number of zones you have.  How many you need depends on whether you want every sensor on its own zone, or whether you are willing to daisy chain several sensors into a single zone (say all windows in each room as a zone).  You would need zone expanders for the Elk or Omni Pro II as well.
 
One thing to consider about self monitoring vs central station monitoring - you can usually get a significant discount on your homeowner's insurance if you have central station monitoring, and that will pretty much cover the cost of the monitoring.  AlarmRelay and NextAlarm are two companies that many people here use.  The cost is as low as $8.95 a month.  There are times and situations when self monitoring just doesn't work.

Click to expand...

RAL-
 
Thanks for the feedback on the Elk / Omni Pro in regards to the HA feature set.  I have to admit that the HA aspect does intrigue me quite a bit and I certainly wouldn't mind "dabbling" in it at some point I just don't know when that is going to happen.  Far to many other projects on the docket before that would be an option.  I also like the fact that if it is built into the panel system you would access the security and HA stuff via one outlet (app) versus having separate stuff the way it is now.  For instance, I have one app for security cams, one app for security system, and then another app for say samsung smartThings.  But like I said, maybe I shouldn't worry about that now because I don't know when that is going to happen if it ever will!
 
I like that the Vista 20P offers the Envisalink option for net access while away.
 
Good to know about the central station monitoring.  I did not know they were that cheap...especially when your used to paying the BIG company fees of $40 and $50 a month (ADT, etc).

DELInstallations said:

The big item is a 20P kit with 2 alpha keypads, expanders, a 7AH battery and all the modules to get the unit out to the outside world, even to interface to a 3rd party automation product for the same or less than an entry M1 and keypad kit. Would the M1 fit into a self monitoring profile with little additional hardware, sure, but you're paying for that flexibility, combined with any ethernet accessibility. The basic Vista 20P, keypad and battery can be had for the sub $250 range vs. $450 + $75 for the DBHR (which is very likely to be necessary) as the basic entry fee to get a 16 zone panel and equivalent battery.
 
Just the facts.
 
If the system was of any great size, had a bunch of peripherals, you'd see the costs align. A fully loaded 20P compared to a M1G, the costs are actually pretty close, but the capabilities are significantly different. There's ways to skin the cat with each and the level of integration or control can vary. You can do quite a bit with a V20P, it's just not as flexible as a M1. All that comes at a price.
 
I've installed hundreds of 20P's (actually the entire Vista line) over the years and quite a few M1's and EZ8's since they first came out. They're both capable panels and good build quality, but the M1 will always be significantly more expensive to install and get up and running part for part.

Click to expand...

DEL-
 
Thanks again for your input...certainly appreciative!  Couple of questions....sorry for the newb ? but why would I need an expander if the control board that you buy comes with 8 zones and I currently only have 8 zones?  Help with acronym "DBHR"?
 
I like that the Vista 20P offers the Envisalink option for net access while away.  I also know that I will need to add to the system too.  I want to def add another motion detector and alarm some windows on the second floor.  Can I re-use the battery that is currently installed in the current "Brinks" unit or should I upgrade?  How do you integrate wireless sensors into the 20P panel....beings that is what I will need for add-on windows sensors?
 
I will say that once we add up the part list item for item especially knowing some "add-on" items I will need to do some other zones, etc if the M1 is close enough maybe I should just go with that?  Disregard the original budget number, I want what will be best now and for the long term that if I need to add on later I can (easily).

The great thing about the Universal Devices ISY994 series is you can have the best of both worlds. Insteon and Zwave in the same controller. I use Insteon for lighting, and Zwave for locks and a inside siren.

I started out with the Elk and XEP Ethernet interface for remote access/control. Later I added the ISY994 and a few Insteon modules as disposable income became available. The Elk and ISY integrate well together. Elk can control the ISY, ISY can monitor and control the Elk.

vacationer said:

DEL-
 
Thanks again for your input...certainly appreciative!  Couple of questions....sorry for the newb ? but why would I need an expander if the control board that you buy comes with 8 zones and I currently only have 8 zones?  Help with acronym "DBHR"?
 
I like that the Vista 20P offers the Envisalink option for net access while away.  I also know that I will need to add to the system too.  I want to def add another motion detector and alarm some windows on the second floor.  Can I re-use the battery that is currently installed in the current "Brinks" unit or should I upgrade?  How do you integrate wireless sensors into the 20P panel....beings that is what I will need for add-on windows sensors?
 
I will say that once we add up the part list item for item especially knowing some "add-on" items I will need to do some other zones, etc if the M1 is close enough maybe I should just go with that?  Disregard the original budget number, I want what will be best now and for the long term that if I need to add on later I can (easily).

Click to expand...

 
If the battery you have is more than 3 years old, it is at the end of its life and should be replaced with a new battery.  In any case, the battery should be sized to the power demands of your new system, so it can provide 4 hours or more of backup run time.
 
If you want to do a direct replacement and keep your zone configuration the same as what you have now with 8 zones, you don't need a zone expander.  So the main Vista 20P board can handle that.
 
If you want to add wireless to the Vista 20P, you can do that with a 6160RF keypad, or with a 5881ENH receiver. 
 
By comparison, the Elk M1 Gold has 16 zones on the base panel, giving you some extra room to grow before any zone expanders are needed. Where the Vista 20P has no output relays or voltage outputs on the base panel, the M1G has 1 relay and 10 voltage outputs that can be used for home automation purposes on the base panel. 
 
Elk offers 3 wireless options for the M1G.  You can add receivers for Honeywell, GE/Interlogix, or Elk's own proprietary wireless sensors.
 
A starter configuration for the Elk, say with 2 keypads and an M1XEP ethernet interface, will cost you about $500 more than a basic Vista 20P with 2 keypads and an EnvisaLink board.