HAI 3.0 Firmware and PC Access Out

[ano]

Wow, I never thought that I'd see the day, but the ver. 3.0 HAI firmware is out!!! I don't have the new FW yet since I have an older non-downloadable panel, but I did download PC Access 3.0 Anyone else try it? I really like the concept, but it kinda reminds me of a program designed with a development kit during the days of Windows 3.1 Come on guys, at least get some tools designed for Windows ME :wacko:

I found one bug. At least for me, my thermostats values do not read at all under the Status/Control Tab. And one other thing, it takes a REAL LONG time to open your file. I'm talking 60 seconds plus to load a Omni Pro II file with maybe 100 lines of programming. Windows even reports that the program is not responding.

Anyone try the v 3.0 firmware?

 

[ASIHome]

Here is a 3.0 update procedure for everybody:

With the release of Dealer PC Access and Firmware 3.0 comes a few common questions. You'll find the answers below.

Steps for Upgrading Dealer PC Access:

If you have v2.9c or higher:
1.) Click on File -> Check for Updades
2.) Click on Next
3.) Click on Update
4.) A webpage will open
5.) Fill in the information and submit
6.) Once you receive the email from HAI, click on the download link
7.) Install

If you have v2.9c or lower:
1.) Send an email to support at homeauto dot com with your Name and serial number requesting the lastest version of Dealer PC Access

Steps for Upgrading Lumina/Omni Controller Firmware:

If you have a 5-port Omni IIe, Omni Pro II, Lumina or Lumina Pro:
Note: No firmware chip is required, firmware is flash upgradeable.
1.) Open Dealer PC Access 3.0
2.) Click on Help
3.) Click on Check for Updates
4.) Download the latest firmware files
5.) Once completed Click on Finish
6.) Click on Communications -> Update Firmware
7.) Select the appropriate firmware for the controller
8.) Follow on screen instructions

If possible it is reccommend to use a serial connection when updating firmware.

If you have a 3-port Omni IIe, Omni Pro II or Omni LT:
1.) Order the firmware upgrade chip that corresponds to your controller.
2.) Once you receive, your order, following the included instructions to update your firmware

Chip upgrade p/n's:

Omni LT - 21A03-1
Omni IIe - 20A04-50
Omni Pro II - 20A04-2
Lumina - 20A04-21
Lumnia Pro - 20A04-22

We carry all the upgrade chips. 3.0 firmware chips are expected within the next 7-10 days.

Thanks.

 

[ano]

Here are other answers that I discovered. I've been on some of the HAI Webinars, but it seems like these answers were never discussed, and I also didn't see them on HAI's web site. Also note, I am in no way associated with HAI, so these answers are what I discovered on my own, and in no way represent the HAI position. If an answer is incorrect, please correct me.

1) Does PC Access 3.0 load files created with earlier versions of PC Access 2.x?
Yes, it does seem to, but as I said earlier, its VERY slow to load, at least on my machine. It looks like the program is hung, but it will eventually work.

2) Does upgrading to PC Access 3.0 remove PC Access 2.x?
No, the upgrade leaves the former version so you can use either.

3) Does PC Access 3.0 support panels with FW prior to 3.0?
Yes, at least it supports 2.15, which is what I have.

4) Do you get new features with PC Access 3.0 when you still have 2.x Firmware?
It appears no, but I may be missing something. PC Access 3.0 connected to a panel with 2.x FW looks a lot like PC Access 2.x with maybe a bit cleaner interface. It seems like PC Access 3.0 runs in a 2.x mode in this case, which causes some problems. For example, if you use the built-in help in PC Access 3.0 it talks about features only available with the 3.0 FW, yet these features AREN'T available with the older 2.x FW. For example, under programming, there is help that explains how to insert an "OR" in your code, but with 2.x FW, this option isn't even visible with PC Access 3.0

One change from previous that I THOUGHT I saw, was that you can now trigger on just about ANY change of any item in your program. If I remember, with PC Access 2.x, triggers were more limited, but then again, this might just be my imagination.

As stated above, I did see a few bugs, or shall we say, things that didn't work exactly as expected. For example, when I went to "Status/Control" I could display my "Outputs" it only displayed the outputs which I had actually named, not all eight in the panel. But what if I want to control an output not named? On the other-hand, in the area for serial ports, PC Access displayed five or more serial ports, yet I have a panel which only physically has three. So why are serial ports I don't have displayed, when outputs I do have aren't?

These bugs will be fixed it time, but I might wait a few months before I upgrade everything.

 

[aard3]

I really like the concept, but it kinda reminds me of a program designed with a development kit during the days of Windows 3.1 Come on guys, at least get some tools designed for Windows ME :wacko:

Anyone try the v 3.0 firmware?

It was developed with Visual Studio 2005, which was released long after any 3.1. PCAccess is designed to be functional. If there is some specific things that you would like changed about the interface, perhaps you might want to make some specific suggestions?

1) Does PC Access 3.0 load files created with earlier versions of PC Access 2.x?
Yes, it does seem to, but as I said earlier, its VERY slow to load, at least on my machine. It looks like the program is hung, but it will eventually work.

Aaron - Yes. PCA3 load older files, and converts them into PCA3 format. So if you save the file in PCA3, you'll be no longer able to open it in PCA2.

2) Does upgrading to PC Access 3.0 remove PC Access 2.x?
No, the upgrade leaves the former version so you can use either.

Aaron - No.

3) Does PC Access 3.0 support panels with FW prior to 3.0?
Yes, at least it supports 2.15, which is what I have.

Aaron - Yes.

4) Do you get new features with PC Access 3.0 when you still have 2.x Firmware?

Aaron - PCA3 is only the PC program, to get all the benefits of 3.0, you need to update to 3.0 firmware. Things like User Settings, the new programming, etc., are require new firmware. PCA3 just allows you to configure these items, but you still need the firmware to work.

Some features are entirely PCA3 dependent, so it just depends. PCA3 won't allow you to do certain thigns if you controller doesn't support it.

 

[gf5300]

aard3,
For the record, I really like what you guys have done with 3.0 and I sure appreciate the fact that it is a free download.
Keep up the good work!

 

[JamesF]

And one other thing, it takes a REAL LONG time to open your file. I'm talking 60 seconds plus to load a Omni Pro II file with maybe 100 lines of programming. Windows even reports that the program is not responding.

Ano,

It shouldn't be taking more then 2-3s to load, however we had a problem similar to this crop up in house on one engineer's machine. The problem was fixed by updating the video drivers on his machine. Is it possible for you to update your video drivers to see if this fixes your problem? If it does would you please respond to this thread to let us know?

Thanks.

 

[psharrock]

I've been using it for most of the day, although not updated my controller as yet, its certainly much easier to use.
I emailed HAI support as I've found some problems, but something else I have noticed that grouping lines uses more lines of code according to PC ACCESS.

EG

WHEN OFF AND DARK THEN LIGHTS ON
WHEN OFF AND DARK THEN LOUNGE AUDIO ON

to

WHEN OFF
AND DARK
THEN LIGHTS ON
THEN LOUNGE AUDIO ON

The first one uses 2 lines, but the 2nd one seems to use 6

So far by grouping loads of things together, I have used 50+ additional lines of code.

Paul

 

[ano]

One small suggestion for a better looking interface maybe to make the width of the data fields in the Status/Control tab match the width of the window like it does on the other tabs. The fact that it doesn't tells me that this looks like a beta rather than a released product.

 

[AnthonyZ]

I will second ano's bug. My thermostat values are not being displayed either. Oh well, after waiting so long for the product (despite repeated promises) I'm sure it won't take 'em more than a year to fix...

 

[aard3]

Anthony and Ano,

What type of thermostats do you guys have (RC2000, RC80, etc), what thermostat numbers are they, etc. The more information you can give the better, it's pretty hard to to track down bugs when the number of possibilities is almost endless. When it first loads, does it display the correct info and it just doesn't update, or does it never show the correct info?

Ano,

I'll pass that along about the width.

AnthonyZ,

"Oh well, after waiting so long for the product (despite repeated promises) I'm sure it won't take 'em more than a year to fix... "

Honestly Anthony, I think we've beat this horse to death. Constructive criticism and bug reports to help us improve products is great and well appreciated. The development team for PCA3 has worked very hard on this project, and while it is unfortunate that it apparently has this bug, with your help, we can get it resolved in a timely manner.

 

[Brian Yokum]

I've been using it for most of the day, although not updated my controller as yet, its certainly much easier to use.
I emailed HAI support as I've found some problems, but something else I have noticed that grouping lines uses more lines of code according to PC ACCESS.

EG

WHEN OFF AND DARK THEN LIGHTS ON
WHEN OFF AND DARK THEN LOUNGE AUDIO ON

to

WHEN OFF
AND DARK
THEN LIGHTS ON
THEN LOUNGE AUDIO ON

The first one uses 2 lines, but the 2nd one seems to use 6

So far by grouping loads of things together, I have used 50+ additional lines of code.

Paul

Paul,

PC Access 3 attempts to optimize the programming when possible. "Traditional" HAI programs had a single trigger, up to two "traditional" conditions, and a single action. If a series of program lines meets this criteria it will take a single "line" of the 1500 on an OmniPro II. If you add multiple triggers, actions, or any of the newer more "complex" conditions the program will be stored as a series of program lines where each trigger, condition, or, and action take up a program line. It's a tradeoff. Sometimes less programs will be used by using the more complex programming available in 3.0, and other times more program lines will be used. In your example, I would expect the first set of programs to take two lines and the second set to take four lines. Note that a comment block will take up a single program line no matter the length of the comment in PC Access.

 

[Brian Yokum]

ano and others,

Note that PC Access 3.0 doesn't endow pre-3.0 controllers with features they didn't previously have. PC Access 3.0 provides a richer environment for programming with comments and descriptions, but there shouldn't be any new capabilities in the controller exposed by 3.0. It may be that PC Access 3.0 inadvertently shows some capabilities in pre-3.0 controllers that it shouldn't, but we've tried to make PC Access 3.0 version aware to only show capabilities that are available in pre-3.0 firmware versus 3.0 and later firmware. As we've added new features in our controllers, it's been a continuing challenge to add support in PC Access where necessary but not allow one to try to access features that are not present in older firmware and/or hardware. If you notice anything that doesn't look correct, please let us know. I can assure you that any problems identified in 3.0 will be correctly promptly. You should check for updates frequently while we address any of these issues.

 

[dlmorgan999]

What type of thermostats do you guys have (RC2000, RC80, etc), what thermostat numbers are they, etc. The more information you can give the better, it's pretty hard to to track down bugs when the number of possibilities is almost endless. When it first loads, does it display the correct info and it just doesn't update, or does it never show the correct info?

I just upgraded and I have the same thermostat issue. I have six RC-80B stats and they are numbered 1-6. All three temperatures are showing 0 for all stats (and they never change). Likewise, all stats are showing "OFF, FAN AUTO, HOLD OFF" even though they are all in AUTO mode as well. If there is any other information I can provide let me know. FYI - I'm a software developer and have been in betas for MANY products over the years so I'd be happy to help testing updates if needed.

Also as an additional note, I found that it took about 80 seconds for my file to open. It has 311 lines of automation and I'm running the software on my Dell laptop running Vista Business. I haven't updated the video drivers recently so I can try that but it doesn't "feel" like a video issue to me. Regardless I'll try the video update anyway and let you know what happens.

-- Dave

 

[AnthonyZ]

Anthony and Ano,

What type of thermostats do you guys have (RC2000, RC80, etc), what thermostat numbers are they, etc. The more information you can give the better, it's pretty hard to to track down bugs when the number of possibilities is almost endless. When it first loads, does it display the correct info and it just doesn't update, or does it never show the correct info?

Honestly Anthony, I think we've beat this horse to death. Constructive criticism and bug reports to help us improve products is great and well appreciated. The development team for PCA3 has worked very hard on this project, and while it is unfortunate that it apparently has this bug, with your help, we can get it resolved in a timely manner.

OK. I use a single RC1000. Both firmware and software match. All zero's from the get go.

As to me giving you guys the business, I will not feel bad for it. As a dealer for some five years (5 Star for two), I have experienced a number of issues that are well known that have been systematically dismissed by HAI. If I'm frustrated it's due to HAI. Remember the temp sensors that were ALWAYS dead on "accurate" despite the field issues that were reported consistently? HAI's wireless (I call 'em "HAI worthless") products? A serial number registration system that randomly assigned my clients software to people in other countries and subsequent refusal by HAI to remedy? Look, we've dealt with a lot. For me as a dealer, I took the brunt of abuse from my clients and in some cases LOST money. If I throw a little back at the manufacturer, I don't feel that I have to be "sensitive to your feelings". It is what it is. I'm in the field. I tell it like I see it. Those who know me (whether in person or via forums) know that I can be coarse but, you'll never hear anything out of me that isn't true. I suppose that I'm honest to a fault.

 

[dlmorgan999]

I haven't updated the video drivers recently so I can try that but it doesn't "feel" like a video issue to me. Regardless I'll try the video update anyway and let you know what happens.

FYI - it turns out that I have the most recent video drivers available already installed.