HAI Dimmer problems

[Oznavad]

I have an OP2 setup with 30 or so HAI dimmers around the house. I've been having issues with couple of newly installed dimmers on a single circuit that feeds multiple light loads around a back door.  One HAI dimmer controls "Back Door Outside" - 2 recessed lights and 2 sconces. The second controls "Back Door Inside" - 3 recessed lights in soffit over door inside. There is also a standard switch that controls two sconces inside the door on the same circuit. The circuit also powers a couple of ceiling lights in the pantry. Typical grabbing hot wherever it is during some remodeling. 
 
So here's the issue - I have perfect control of the inside dimmer as long as the outside dimmer is off. When the outside is on, I can't control the inside. The outside dimmer will go on by command, but won't turn off. 
I have changed the outsdie dimmer with a new switch, same results. My guess is some issue created through the adhock wiring of this circuit that is throwing off communication, but not sure what type of wiring configuration would lead to such problems. Maybe improper tying together of neutrals??Any thoughts?

 

[mikefamig]

Or maybe the switches are sending links to each other? I would start by resetting them both to factory default and then re programming them.
 
Mike.

 

[mikefamig]

I have changed the outsdie dimmer with a new switch, same results. My guess is some issue created through the adhock wiring of this circuit that is throwing off communication, but not sure what type of wiring configuration would lead to such problems. Maybe improper tying together of neutrals??Any thoughts?

 
Were there ever conventional switches installed in these locations and did they work properly or did you install the UPB switches as new installs?
 
Mike.

 

[Oznavad]

I've reset them both multiple times. And yes, there were conventional switches that worked fine.

 

[ano]

I have an OP2 setup with 30 or so HAI dimmers around the house. I've been having issues with couple of newly installed dimmers on a single circuit that feeds multiple light loads around a back door.  One HAI dimmer controls "Back Door Outside" - 2 recessed lights and 2 sconces. The second controls "Back Door Inside" - 3 recessed lights in soffit over door inside. There is also a standard switch that controls two sconces inside the door on the same circuit. The circuit also powers a couple of ceiling lights in the pantry. Typical grabbing hot wherever it is during some remodeling. 
 
So here's the issue - I have perfect control of the inside dimmer as long as the outside dimmer is off. When the outside is on, I can't control the inside. The outside dimmer will go on by command, but won't turn off. 
I have changed the outsdie dimmer with a new switch, same results. My guess is some issue created through the adhock wiring of this circuit that is throwing off communication, but not sure what type of wiring configuration would lead to such problems. Maybe improper tying together of neutrals??Any thoughts?

This is a problem when the light being controlled interferes with the switch controlling it.  You could switch the bulbs in the fixture or you could add a UPB filter between the outside lights and the switch. Certainly switching bulbs is easier if you can. You said two recessed and two scones, one or the other is causing the problem.

 

[mikefamig]

I agree with ano that noise could be causing the problem. The fact that the problem arises when you turn the outside light on suggests that it is the outside light causing the noise.
 
Have you done noise and signal tests with Upstart software?
 
Mike.

 

[mikefamig]

I've reset them both multiple times. And yes, there were conventional switches that worked fine.

If the circuit worked fine with conventional switches and you installed the UPB switches properly then I don't see how the wiring can be the problem.
 
Mike.

 

[mikefamig]

This link may help you understand noise and using upstart to troubleshoot:
 
http://www.simply-automated.com/documents/application_notes/Troubleshooting%20UPB%20Communications.pdf

 

[Oznavad]

This is a problem when the light being controlled interferes with the switch controlling it.  You could switch the bulbs in the fixture or you could add a UPB filter between the outside lights and the switch. Certainly switching bulbs is easier if you can. You said two recessed and two scones, one or the other is causing the problem.

You got it! It was LED bulbs causing the noise. Need to see if it was the LED sconce bulbs or the recessed LEDs.
Great thanks Ano and Mike. Saved me a lot of head scratching

 

[mikefamig]

I control a half dozen or so Cree LED bulbs with SA switches and they work properly. You might try changing a bulb for another brand before anything else.
 
Mike.

 

[ano]

I haven't had problems with too many LED bulbs, but there are some which are definitely troublemakers. Typically these are Chinese made bulbs that use a cheap type switching power supply that creates high electrical spikes of noise.  These spikes can jam UPB signals. When you discover the problem just stay away from that type bulb in the future. I never buy too many bulbs to start. I just buy one to test it and make sure it works with UPB before buying a bunch. (UPStart can display UPB noise levels.)